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[0:00] Jeff Malone: Welcome to Half Hour with Jeff and Richie, the podcast where we explore the latest shows we see, sharing our insights and opinions on the performances, storylines, and everything in between. In today's episode, we're discussing the off-Broadway production of Slam Frank. Whether you cannot catch the show in person or you want to expand your thoughts after seeing it, this episode is for you. And as always, we want to inform you that this episode will contain spoilers. So if you're ready to dive into this production, stick around with us. I'm Jeff.

[0:25] Richie Grasso: And I'm Richie. We're thrilled to be your hosts for today's episode. But before we start the conversation about Slam Frank, here are a few words from our advertisers. Welcome, everyone, to a new episode of Half Hour with Jeff and Richie. Today, we're discussing Slam Frank. A show within a show, an ultra-progressive regional theater company stages its opening night of The Diary of Anne Frank, rewritten as an Afro-Latin hip-hop musical. The satire's target is the company and its politics, not Anne. Inspired by a viral 2022 tweet asking whether Anne Frank ever acknowledged her, quote, white privilege, end quote. Okay, what a synopsis that is.

[1:05] Jeff Malone: And let's dive into our bold statement here a little differently this time, Richie. We each prepared three words. You haven't seen my words. I haven't seen yours. Three bold words. Three bold words you would use to describe your experience of Slam Frank before we dive in. So let's hear them.

[1:23] Richie Grasso: I'm going to go with daring, shocking, and my last word, exhausting.

[1:32] Jeff Malone: Okay. So believe it or not, folks, we didn't know this, but two of those three, I had the same ones.

[1:37] Richie Grasso: Oh, really? Believe it or not. I said daring. Okay. I said shocking. Wow. And I said confusing. At times.

[1:43] Jeff Malone: So I want to dive into all that.

[1:43] Richie Grasso: Okay. All right. So when we look at this, we're looking at comedy. We're looking at satire. We're looking at something really, really bold and out there. We're taking things that have worked in comedy before and we're pushing the boundary. And I always kind of say in this podcast, everything belongs on stage, push the boundaries of the drama, push the boundaries of the comedy. We're in new worlds today and there's so much going on and try new things, right? So it's very clear that this creative team tried something new. They took ideas from other things that have worked in the past that seemed to have success. And then they put them into this and they really pushed that envelope to the point where I have seen and heard from people all over the spectrum of people that said they couldn't stand the show.

They walked out. They were so confused. One of my words, they had no idea what was going on. They were offended by it. It was really, really not their cup of tea at all. And then I have people literally on the other side saying 10 out of 10, no notes. I mean, in a way, when you leave a show hearing all of that, you already know that this is going to stir up some buzz and press. This is going to stir up some word of mouth. This is going to get people there because everyone's going to want to, well, let me see if I love it or hate it. It's kind of like not to compare it at all to something like paranormal activity, but when everyone says paranormal activity is so scary, it lets people say, well, let me go see if it's, I love horror movies.

And then people say, it's not that scary or, oh my gosh, it was so scary. Right. So when you're pushing the envelope in anything, like I just use examples of horror, comedy, drama, I think that gives an opportunity to say, well, I'll be the judge of that. Right. And so I think it was cool that we kind of went to this experience really open, not really knowing much about it and kind of diving in. Now it's almost two hours with no intermission. You sink into it. You're kind of in it. And then, I mean, from my experience, we left the theater and it may be one of the first times, I'm not kidding, I've ever left a theater where I didn't speak or know what to say to you for about five minutes.

[3:50] Richie Grasso: That's true, y'all. We walked all the way to the subway, which was approximately a five-minute walk. And I wanted to say things, but there was something in my brain that's telling me process, process. It's kind of like when something's downloading, right? Like still downloading, still down. My brain was still downloading this and processing this and digesting it. There's nothing wrong with that. But I think usually I leave something to say, okay, I think I had a good vibe of that. Or, oh, I don't know if I like, I was so all over the place with this that I kind of left like, okay, I'm not going to talk about this for about five minutes. I think I just need to leave the theater and get some fresh air and kind of walk away. Did you feel the same way?

[4:37] Jeff Malone: I did. I mean, I had many thoughts right away, especially even while watching this piece. I thought like from a concept standpoint here, we're dealing with a show within a show. So right off the bat, I immediately started like thinking like, how are we following this as like a plot through line as this being a show within a show and their take on putting this production of The Diary of Anne Frank on? And from that point, like I had to watch every single moment within this piece to say like, are they meeting that goal? Right? So like that was my initial thought. That was like probably when I left that theater, I said, I don't know if they necessarily kind of finished that thought of doing the show within the show.

[5:26] Richie Grasso: Well, there was this concept of someone comes out, we're this progressive theater company, we're putting on this show, they acknowledge the land, right? They do all of that. And then it doesn't really end like that. It doesn't say like shows over or like, oh, we're breaking the show down a little bit. Like when people break character and the mic was ripped off and the person, right? And some of that was happening. And you're like, wait, so were we in the show within a show? I think still, right? Like I sometimes see shows within a show and I'm like, okay, stage management, bring the lights up, curtain down. Like we're closing up the show here. And they didn't really bookend it like that, even though they bookended it at the beginning. So yes, I agree with you. Then I feel like that was something I'm like, I think we're still the show within the show, right? That's how I felt.

[6:02] Jeff Malone: Right. And I do agree with you as well on like leaving the theater and like kind of being speechless about like what to even say, because there is so much that is happening within this piece. And I feel like, you know, I'll give the creators credit where credit's due. I think it's kind of inspiring to see like that something that sparked such a commotion from a tweet about like, did Anne Frank ever check her white privilege created something like this? I think like this is the satire on social media and identity politics that kind of is needed. I think like we are so focused and constantly scrolling and doom scrolling to a point where like, that's what this musical felt like. You know, it felt like you almost were scrolling through TikTok or Instagram and like, you're watching this and then you're watching this and this person saying this to you and that person saying this to you and how do, how are we all supposed to handle that?

And I wonder if the show felt exhausting and confusing to me because the real world sometimes feels really exhausting and confusing. So personally, I like to look at theater as escapism at times. This was not escapism theater. This was like, nope, stay in the world and let's tell you a different side of it.

[7:17] Jeff Malone: Now we had talked a little bit of Richie about like offensiveness, right? Who's offended by this? And there is this theory that anybody and everybody could be offended by this. I think that's what the creative team took. We're not going to just target one specific group or people, even though it's about, you know, the diary of Anne Frank in that way, there's so many different groups that people could say, oh, that doesn't offend me. Now that does, that doesn't offend me. Oh, but now that does. And you could kind of ping pong on that. Right. Do you agree that like there was this concept of let's just offend everybody and like, then we can gloves off, do it. And then, hey, we have nothing to really say because we've said it all in the piece.

Right. Because I think that is what they were trying to achieve with this piece. So again, I think multiple questions get asked from that. I think that says like, if you have offended everyone, have you offended no one? I think that is like really what one of the questions is here. Right.

[8:14] Richie Grasso: Yeah. And I think, you know, then we look at this story of the diary of Anne Frank, which is not that old of a story. Right. And I think when I think of the diary of Anne Frank, I think of real sadness. And I really, really have emotional sadness for this family and what went through in these diaries and whatnot. And so I think there's a part of me just sitting there saying, I don't know, this seems I get it. I get what they're trying to do, but there's always this looming in the back of my mind of like, this is still kind of sad, this story. And I don't, is this OK? You know, there's always like, wait, is it OK they did that? Is it OK they did that? But in general, I don't mean to compare this to The Producers.

Right. Because if you think of Mel Brooks comedy, Mel Brooks comedy in some of this concept was some of the first comedy to push boundaries like that. This makes Mel Brooks, The Producers look very tame. Right. But at the time, people were walking. That movie was controversial. People were like, oh my gosh, what are you talking about springtime? What? But I think it's different because I think like that's where we go back to the word comedy and then we go back to the word satire. I think like The Producers is not satire, it's comedy. And this is satire. It's really tackling so many different political moments that are happening within our time in this piece, you know, and to play devil's advocate of like what you're talking about here with The Diary of Anne Frank.

There are so many people out there that say, well, that's not her direct diary that was rewritten and there are things added to it. And there are a lot of people that feel that way. So I feel like that is a major part of what's being talked about in this musical because they're saying like, well, it's already been done or people already think it's been rewritten by her father. Like so I think that that is a big thing that they're also bringing into. Well, they're trying. Right. I just feel like it is still this really sad story. I don't associate satirical comedy with this sad story. So that's why I'm sitting there like, I think I'm confused right now.

[10:13] Jeff Malone: I'm just sitting there kind of like, okay, well, I can be a sponge right now. I can take things in. I'm watching some things and I'm like, I don't know. And we're going to get into this in the next segment, some specifics with direction and acting, but I'm just watching some things like, oh, okay, kind of fun. And then, oh, uh, so I feel like I'm on this rollercoaster and I just feel like, uh, or, or maybe, maybe not much of a rollercoaster as much as like, I'm in a car that's breaking and then it's gassing up and then breaking and then gassing up. And that's what I felt like the whole time to the point where if I was in a real car and that was happening for two hours, I'd be nauseous by the end.

So maybe, I don't know. I just feel like I'm all over the place with this. I am not. If I sat here right now and said, this is the best thing ever. People are going to be like, what? And if I sat here and say, this is the worst thing ever, people are going to be like, what? Right. So like, I don't know where on the spectrum yet I fall, even as I'm sitting here recording, I'm kind of just sitting here very numb, taking it in, remembering what I always say, which is that all stories can belong on the stage, but when you really dissect certain stories in some ways, you know, the question, the age old question comes, was this correct? Was this right? Was this needed? Was this wanted? And people could argue all those questions I just said.

And so that's what's the beauty of the art form of theater is that we can sit here and some people can love this and think this is the best thing. And some people can hate this. And there's been a lot of theater before this that has been like that. This just feels extremely cutting edge in that way.

[11:36] Richie Grasso: Totally agree. And it's achieving one thing. It's achieving a lot of conversation that around this piece that I think that the creators want to happen. So on that note, we're going to take a quick break and when we get back, we're going to get into the overall production of this piece.

[11:54] Jeff Malone: Okay. And we're back. So let's get into this overall production. Now that's playing at the Orpheum Theater. This is now the second off-Broadway run of the piece. So let's get into the creative team.

[12:05] Richie Grasso: Yeah. I mean, we have music, lyrics and arrangements by Andrew Fox, a book by Joel Sinensky. Do I think that the score has some catchy bop kind of feel moments? I think that was the intention of it. I don't really walk away remembering much of it other than when she's singing about writing in her diary, because that's all over their ads right now. And I see their ads all over the place with that. But I engaged in the song. Sure. The songs are moving the piece through. I don't think anything is extremely memorable for me personally, but I didn't think anything seemed out of left field either.

[12:43] Jeff Malone: Yeah. I probably would argue on that, that is it memorable or is it also relatable? And sometimes when we want to listen to music, we want something that is going to be relatable. So if we're not actually relating to the music on a level that's like, oh, I want to listen to that, then that's where I feel like the memorable moment comes in. And that's a lot of Broadway and off-Broadway musicals. Like if you don't relate to the music, you're really not going to take it home with you and say like, oh, I'm going to continue listening to that. I do find like they're very inspired and there's like a lot of ode into many different musicals, especially Hamilton. I think like that's probably their big muse that they were inspired by there, that this musical was written by. It just, it doesn't land the same way that Hamilton's score lands, I feel.

[13:31] Richie Grasso: We also have direction by Sam LaFrage. I think what was kind of cool about the direction was that it felt like we were going to bring things out and change things and bring ladders and move people around with cameras. And in this very small space, I think there was a cool direction to it. I saw audience members sitting on the stage and I actually didn't personally like that they were all kind of just like never really used in the piece or like when you put people up on stage, usually you talk to them, you reference them, maybe you pull them up and do something with them. And they felt like kind of like just part of the scenery. So I don't, I wish they were kind of acknowledged more, used more, unless they were just trying to get 10 or 20 more seats in the facility to get people up there.

But it also kind of goes back to that feel of like, oh, we're the theater company putting on the show, bring the actors up. But that's what I think it is. I think it's, you know, when we talk about the word satire again, and satire on the theater industry, I think that they brought a lot of the tried and true ideas that are brought into theater many times, sitting people on the stage, coming out and speaking before the show starts, coming into the audience and dancing, they brought a lot of that. And I think that's also where the comedy does come into play. It's like the mocking of the theater industry that does these certain things. So that's why I think they were sitting on the stage, other than there was no interaction.

Well, even with the videos and the camera person going around, then they had the crew guy coming out and doing things and helping them and being part of it at times. There was all these odes to what we do in the theater.

[15:07] Jeff Malone: And the gimmicks.

[15:08] Richie Grasso: Yeah. Again, I just feel like we, like we said earlier, it kind of gets to this point at the end where like, then we take a hard right turn to some serious stuff and then it gets very serious. And then it doesn't, personally, I don't know if it a hundred percent resolves back to that, like, but remember, we're the theater troupe. So like, have a good night. Like, you know, and so it's tough, but I think there was some cool direction moments. I think the choreography was strong too. And like I said, choreography in that small space is tough, but they moved the actors throughout in so many ways, even into the audience, using some audience interaction moments. I think in general, given a piece like this, we were moving people through pretty rapidly and pretty successfully for an hour and 15 minute nonstop piece.

[15:50] Jeff Malone: Yeah. I agree with that too. And some of the other designers here, we have set design by Adam Koch. We have lighting design by Jamie Roderick, sound design by Gage Baker and video design by Zach Logo. I think that's where a lot of this was coming into play for me here because they took that whole Jamie Lloyd effect of bringing the camera work onto the stage, going through the stage, having you see different moments in there. I think that worked really well. I find Adam Koch's set design to usually be very immersive and avant-garde in a way that I think I'm very intrigued by it when I walk into that space. And costume design by Sarah Lockwood as well, which you had different people dressed in different ways to represent different cultures and different characters. And that was tough too when you're dealing with this troop of actors that are sometimes playing multiple characters too throughout.

[16:38] Richie Grasso: Right. I agree with that as well.

[16:42] Jeff Malone: Yeah. So now when we get into some of the actor performances in here, who actually stood out to you in this piece?

[16:46] Richie Grasso: Well, I will say, I thought all the actors were very strong. They're committed to the bit, right? So whatever we feel about the piece, and we've been talking a lot about the controversy of it and like, oh, I don't know about this. I don't know about that. But the actors are committing to it. So remember, actors are given a script and given direction and they got to run with it. So what the actors have been given, you know, I will say Olivia Bernabe, who's playing Anne or Anita here, right, is really strong of a performer. She's holding it together. She's playing the title role. And she's like having to hold this whole piece together in this like juvenile way and also this mature way. And I think she sings it well. And I think she she's a strong leading presence in the piece.

[17:26] Jeff Malone: Yeah, I found her funny. I think she really took on this whole persona. It's very like inspired by Dora the Explorer in a way where she's like, I'm gonna write in my diary now. And then like, the grandma comes in the ghost of the abuela and is like, Anita, you know, and I think like, and she's like, what? And like, that's funny. That's where some comedy was really happening in this piece. And she was super committed to that. Because if that was me, I probably would hysterically start laughing every night on stage in that moment where it's like that she has to play into that and how the audience is reacting to her. You know, I think she did a great job in this piece.

[18:04] Richie Grasso: Anybody else stand out for you?

[18:12] Jeff Malone: I think they mostly all really were on the same level. And like what you said, I think like really committing to the bit was important in this piece. I think someone who has a harder role in this piece is Amelia Louise Barr, who plays Margot. I find her role to be very interesting, because she's also the one that's like, it's kind of like storms off the stage in the middle. And then it's like, okay, she's really committed to this piece in a different way. And how that is written is also interesting, because that's where it lost me when I go back to what we were talking about earlier is like, when does the show within the show stop happening? Because if she was just playing the role, she shouldn't be so, you know, attached to what her character is doing in the show, unless that's, you know, implied or kind of told to her that that's how she's supposed to play this, because she's maybe she's going a little more method with this.

And she's truly taking on what's happening with that role. So hers is interesting. And she's also very silent. But then she also plays the abuela. And then it's like, she's going back and forth. So yeah, I think she has a hard time in this in this.

[19:19] Richie Grasso: Yeah, yeah. And I think she does a great job. And the singing is very good. They're all singing very good. She sings very well. I mean, this is a musical too, right? And they're singing tough stuff. They're trying to imitate that pop hip hop sound, which can be difficult to sing. And so I think they were all doing a great job with that.

[19:38] Jeff Malone: Yeah, I agree with that as well. And were there any like numbers that really stood out to you in this piece that like, you kind of go back to and say, Oh, I remember what was happening?

[19:47] Richie Grasso: Well, again, like I was saying, just the writing down in the diary, and they're like, she's gonna write it down. They're like, Oh, and they're showing this whole like, very Hamilton as like, it's about the diary. And like, and I just felt like that was like, it was just catchy, because it just keeps getting repeated, I think. But again, I think not as many things stood out for me as memorable as I thought would have been.

[20:02] Jeff Malone: And do you feel like the show kind of started out maybe at 100? And then maybe slowly started deflating? A little bit only because I thought the end took us to real serious stuff. And I was like, Oh, this is where I'm like, Oh, gosh, okay.

[20:25] Jeff Malone: And then I kind of, I don't want to say zone out, but I kind of step out and I say, okay, I don't know what I'm, I'm just going to sit in quietly and watch. Cause now I don't know if I'm supposed to be laughing or not. Like that's where the confusion word came from that I used earlier. Like the, am I supposed to be laughing? Because the amount of people in that audience who didn't laugh once, and the amount of people in that audience that wouldn't stop laughing, is really interesting to me. That shows the divide of the country right now and the world in the world, of course too. And these worldly issues we're talking about, where someone can go see that and hysterically laugh all the time. And someone will see that and just not laugh once and not like it.

Again, I'm just commenting on that experience. And I just look at all aspects of this and like, oh, that's funny. That's not, oh, I'm not going to laugh. Oh, maybe I'll laugh. Oh, I don't know if I liked that. Oh, I like that jarring feel. I guess that's maybe how a lot of people felt leaving. I did feel that way. And that's why I'm asking the question on like, did it start at a 100? I think it did, because I think it started at a level that I think we wanted it to kind of stay consistent through and when it deflates into something that felt different is where I think the confusion or even the exhausting part of this musical felt towards the end. And also it is an hour and 50 minutes. So this is a lot of information that is no intermission.

And I don't think you can really have an intermission because how do you take yourself out of that for 15 minutes and then go back? And I actually think probably a lot of people wouldn't go back for act two, which is why they have to keep it going. That, yeah, I find like it could be slightly exhausting by the end there.

[22:01] Richie Grasso: So, all right. Well, I think this is a great time to take another quick break here. And when we get back, we're gonna get into our own experience at the show and what we think might be next for the future of this production. Okay, and we're back. So let's get into our own experience at the show. Like I said earlier, a mix of people saying so many things throughout, laughing hysterically, finding this to be so funny. Some people, not at all. A couple of people leaving in the middle. We saw that. You know, it's in a small venue. It's downtown. It's now in second off Broadway venue. It does have a limited run. I believe it's running till the end of November. I'm curious to see where this goes because it's so controversial.

However, we've had a lot of controversial things on Broadway before. I don't know if this goes to a bigger Broadway venue. I wonder if this kind of does a little bit of a tour, licenses out to some communities or regionals that want to maybe take it up and do it. Maybe they'll try to go do this somewhere around the country or even in London or somewhere else in a smaller way. I'm noticing a lot more of the off-Broadway things kind of staying in smaller venues, touring smaller venues and keeping in that circuit versus immediately going to Broadway. If the hopes are for this creative team to bring this to Broadway, I would say that they're definitely going to have to be ready for a lot. You're gonna have critics all over the map with this.

You might have people potentially boycotting it. You may have people running to see it multiple times. Again, there's the gamut of people here that are looking at this with different lenses because I think we all look at politics and the news and the world news with different lenses. You sit amongst five or 10 or 15 people and some person knows a lot about one thing and some person doesn't know about another and some people think something's funny and some people don't and that's just the dynamic of the world. So it would be interesting if it elevated to a Broadway level.

[23:45] Jeff Malone: What's interesting is I feel that we're in such a comedy high right now when we talk about the things like O'Meary and Titanic. Heated rivalry. Heated rivalry. I mean, some of these things are really working and can move to the Broadway stage. When I look at something like Slam Frank, I would be worried for a piece like this because like you said, I think that this would spark a huge outrage or boycott to this piece unless they were to maybe make some changes to it. I think that they would need to go in with a stronger focus on what we're supposed to feel like when we leave that theater rather than trying to tackle every single thing. And that's why I don't know if I was to ask the creative team, how do you want people leaving this theater?

I wonder if their response would be, however you want. They probably would say that. Some directors and creative teams want you to like take a message away from something. I say, remember this when you're walking out, right? But maybe this creative team is like, we kind of threw a lot at you and just absorb some of it. Think of some things. Maybe it changes your opinion on some things. Maybe it doesn't. Maybe it actually makes you stay rooted more in your beliefs of certain things. But maybe the creative team kind of volleyed that to you. It's kind of like when you go to a museum, a painter has painted a painting. It's up there and I can look at that painting and think it's tragic. And you could look at that painting and say it's beautiful.

And that's the beauty of the art form in a way. Is the painter's not there saying, oh, look at that flower. I want you to feel sadness looking at that flower. No painter's standing next to. So the creative team might say, look at the work and take from it what you want. But in this case, that works in this off-Broadway space. This does not work in commercial mass Broadway, in my opinion. Maybe because it's so controversial, maybe.

[25:39] Richie Grasso: Right. And I also don't see this as like a, oh and oh Mary, where they're just gonna, you know, stunt cast it throughout. And then it continues to live on and on. Unless, you know, there were really people that want to go into these roles. But I couldn't see that happening. What I could see happening though is going to more of a commercial off-Broadway space like New World Stages that is in the Broadway mix and it kind of sits down there for a little bit. That I could see happening. But does it go and kind of get eaten up by the Broadway space? I don't know. Like that, I wouldn't want to see that, you know, go there and then it's like, oh, okay, well it didn't work there. You know, I mean, everyone's goal is Broadway, but I do think like we should be more big on having a nice successful off-Broadway run.

Look at Little Shop of Horrors. It's been running for years and it has found its home. Would that show still be running on Broadway if it went there first? I don't know. And it did go to Broadway, but also at one point, but don't forget—

[26:42] Jeff Malone: I'm talking about that production.

[26:43] Richie Grasso: Yeah, but not everyone necessarily always wants Broadway. The Fantastics ran off-Broadway forever and now it's actually just making its Broadway debut, right? So everyone's different with that. It's something that we talked about with Sean when we had him on our podcast is talking about heated rivalry. He's like that show is meant to stay off-Broadway and they want to keep growing the buzz for that show there. And I think that's something that Slam Frank can do. If you're in a smaller house, you could sell it out and more and more people will create this demand of like, oh, I need to go see that show that everyone's talking about. So I think that's a good way to look at it, right?

[27:20] Jeff Malone: Oh my gosh, we're just about out of time. All right, we've talked a lot about Slam Frank here in many different ways. What are your final recap thoughts here on Slam Frank off-Broadway?

[27:30] Richie Grasso: I sit probably more on the fence of I liked this. I think it is creating conversation that is meant to be created in the theater space. There is a lot going on. So buckle up and embrace yourself into this piece and then have big, real rooted conversations about it after. It's not perfect, but it is doing something that I enjoyed. I would say the same thing to the people who loved it as the same thing to the people who hated it, which in my final thoughts here, I would say, well, why? I see so many people say, oh, I loved it. No, no, it's amazing, but why? Tell me why. Let's talk about it. Go deeper. Or some people, oh, I hate it, I hate it. Oh my gosh, I would never, no, no, no. Well, tell me why.

Because I am still leaving this podcast even after talking about it for 30 minutes, still like, you know, I'm not saying I'm on the fence or I'm wishy-washy, I'm trying to dodge around. I'm just kind of sitting here soaking it in still because I found this to be so wildly all over the place that I'm like, all right, I see that scene. Ooh, I see that scene. Ah, I see that scene. Ooh, I just am sitting in this like, educate me on things. Let me educate myself more on things. Let me see. And I say, I'm not saying I loved it or I hated it. I'm just kind of sitting here like, I don't know. There were some really confusing moments, some shocking moments. And maybe that is more reflective on the viewer to say, oh, I need to learn more about that.

Or I actually, nope, I know enough about that. I don't need to know, right? And so let your mind kind of go back and forth. But I would say the same thing to the people. Tell me why you loved it. Tell me why you hated it. And let's have those conversations, right? And have you come full circle now though, from when you left the theater at Slam Frank where you were speechless to now, and after you sat with it, do you have a different feeling on it?

[29:13] Jeff Malone: I just, like I said, I think I'm able to just verbalize more but I still think that I'm sitting here like, oh gosh, I'm still very shocked by that. And it was exhausting in a way because it was just so in your face. And everyone, and some people still go up to me like, oh, let me tell you some reasons why I didn't like it. And then let me tell you why I really liked it, right? And I'm like, okay, I'll listen. I would listen and let's converse. The only way we can really move the art form along is if we converse about it instead of saying, I don't wanna talk about it, right? Let's talk a little bit.

[29:42] Richie Grasso: Yeah, and I agree with that. And I feel like if we had to recommend this to one person, I feel like people that love political satire definitely should go check this out because I feel like they would be fully into something like this piece. I look at it like, well, if you keep hearing things about it and you're like, oh, I hear this, I hear that. I would say, okay, now I guess go see it to see what you think of it. It sounded like I said, if someone says something so scary or so funny, well, then you might wanna be your own judge.

[30:12] Jeff Malone: Yes. Well, that does wrap up our discussion for this episode. And we hope you enjoyed our deep dive into Slam Frank. And remember, we want to hear from you. Continue the conversation with us on Instagram and TikTok at half hour podcast and drop us a comment on Spotify and let us know your thoughts on Slam Frank. Please also leave us a review. Your reviews mean so much to us. And remember to subscribe to our channel for all past and future episodes. Until next time, I'm Jeff.