This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Jess: Hello and welcome to the Musicals with Cheese podcast. Today I've got a very special guest known as a composer, actress, performer, and everything under the sun, Lulu Fall.

[0:14] Lulu Fall: Hello. I'm so excited. It's my first podcast.

[0:19] Jess: Really? Wow. That's actually surprising because you've got a laundry list of like things you're involved in from like Hadestown, Natasha Pierre, The Great Comet of 1812, and a bunch of other your own compositions too.

[0:29] Lulu Fall: Yeah, I do. I do. It's exciting. Very, very exciting stuff.

[0:37] Jess: Tell us a little bit about yourself and your relationship to musical theater and how... because you even admitted that you like what you like. You're not like deep into it. So I'm very interested in how you got involved in it.

[0:45] Lulu Fall: Yeah, it's like I know a lot of people who are like, you know, not even just musical theater heads, but like true theater nerds and know every single show from like, you know, classic to non-classic, traditional to not. And I just kind of slipped in the cracks. There are like many shows that I love, but they're very niche. They're very contemporary. They're very off the beaten path. And there are lots of other shows that I'm just like, well, I've heard of it, but I don't, I don't think I've seen it. So anyway, brief introduction. Um, I have always been interested in singing, dancing, acting, creating, period. And, um, I started dancing as a kid. My parents enrolled me in, um, in dance classes.

Um, I, you know, dabbled in theater a lot. Uh, I also knew that I could sing, but I had stage fright actually until college. So, yeah, so, um, that's kind of crazy. Right. So I somehow did my best to evade singing solo, uh, up until like high school when I went to an arts high school and I had to, you know? Um, but yeah, so because I already had this love for singing, dancing, and acting, I naturally wanted to merge all three and just get more comfortable with being on stage and, you know, just expressing myself through, you know, these different mediums. And, uh, so by the time I got to high school, I went to Duke Ellington school of the arts in DC where I'm from. And, uh, I originally was accepted into the vocal program.

But then as soon as like, I think it was, uh, the first day of school or something, they gathered a few of us, uh, who were contenders for, uh, becoming basically the Guinea pigs of this new division within the theater department that was called musical theater. And of course, the year that I got there was the year that they started the program. The year after I graduated is the year that they ended the program. So it was, it was a very, very short lived program. And I learned, I learned a lot. Um, now with that said, after high school, I decided to just focus on music in college and just go back to the very thing that I really love, but that I'm terrified of, you know, or I was terrified of, and I studied jazz in college and that's how I just, you know, learned to play a little bit of piano and learned about like, uh, you know, theory and composition and just, that's when I started to understand myself vocally a bit more.

And then after college, I was like, all right, I'm going to be a jazz singer. And then boom, I ended up auditioning for this show called crowns in, in DC. It was a rendition of crowns in Washington, DC. And I ended up getting the understudy part. And this is 2009. So mind you, I have only been in this business professionally for 10 years in the musical theater business, which is kind of nuts because I have done a lot and I'm very, very thankful, but I'm telling you, I busted my behind, you know, just going from, uh, studying musical theater in high school, where sure I learned a lot, but since we were Guinea pigs of that program, a lot of it was, you know, us just kind of being shoved into a class and curriculum had already started.

So I didn't quite know a lot about a lot. I just know a little bit about a little bit. So I just ended up learning a lot on the job, starting with crowns. Uh, Oh, I wasn't an understudy. Excuse me. I was a swing. I was a swing. That was my first job in 2009. So I hit the ground running. Um, I know what I love and I work really, really, really hard to cultivate what I love and develop what I love. Um, and since then, you know, I've been hustling like crazy, taking classes, obviously, you know, booking all the shows that I've done, uh, thus far and yeah, here we are today. So it's been a crazy journey.

[4:52] Jess: That's an incredible journey. Like really you're so young and yet you've done so much. That is remarkable. Congratulations to you and for all of your success up to this point. And the success I know is coming ahead, like even further than either of us can probably imagine.

[5:02] Lulu Fall: Oh yeah. Yeah. I can't imagine it. I feel it though, you know, but it's some, some big stuff are coming. So I'm happy about that.

[5:14] Jess: So after you, how did you get over that initial stage fright that you had? Like, was there like, was there a moment where it's like, okay, that's gone or is it still somewhat there?

[5:23] Lulu Fall: Uh, it's definitely gone. I mean, sure. I get a little nervous naturally, but I know how to channel that nervousness into energy and focus, you know, as opposed to, you know, wanting to just flee. But, uh, to be honest, I would say between me and you, but everyone's listening. I, between me and you and everyone, I almost flunked out of college my freshman year. Cause I had, uh, I had juries and I did poorly in it because I was like scared to sing. I was like, oh my God, Lulu. And, uh, I passed like by the skin of my teeth. And I remember my vocal teacher pulling me aside and saying, you need to get it together. I don't understand why you have stage fright and why you're letting that, you know, hinder you from your, your budding career because you have something, but you got to let all that stuff go or you will not be enrolled at Michigan state.

And I was like, oh, oh, okay. So that literally snapped me into place. I remember calling my mom and she was like, I love you. I'm not going to tell your dad, get it together. And she just hung up on me and she never hanged up on me. So after that, I was like, all right, Lulu, it's time to get over this shit.

[6:36] Jess: Mark, sorry. I just cursed.

[6:41] Lulu Fall: No, you're allowed to curse. Swear as much as you want. You're good.

[6:45] Lulu Fall: Oh, thank you. Feel free. Yeah. So I think that that was the thing. I sadly had to get to that, but it was so bad. It was pretty crippling, you know? And, uh, yeah, you were born and raised in DC, but you went to Michigan state.

[6:53] Lulu Fall: That is correct. Um, random, but I was really, really cool with my high school guidance counselor. I know that sounds nerdy, but she was amazing. And she was like in her early twenties. So I just felt like I could relate to her on very, very deep levels. And one time that I was in there, the admissions, uh, what was he like a recruiting officer for Michigan state just happened to be in her office. And, you know, he talked a big game on top of that, my good friend, Ben Williams, who was an excellent basis and composer. He was already at his first year at Michigan state while I was wrapping up my senior year, uh, at Duke Ellington in DC. And so I already had a contact to, you know, call and just kind of ask questions about the school too. And, um, he loved it. And I was like, all right, I guess I'm going to go study jazz. And between me and you and everyone, that was the only school I applied to.

[7:56] Jess: That is incredible. I live in Michigan and I'm like, wow. I'm always amazed at the people that come to Michigan from other places and how they interpret this state and like the education they get there. It's just very interesting to me. And it's very common in musical theater.

[8:10] Lulu Fall: Yeah. I mean, especially at the university of Michigan and Ann Arbor and everyone always thought, oh yeah, you went to U of M and I'm like, no, no, I went to Michigan state.

[8:21] Jess: You went to Lansing, like, yep, yep, yep. Yeah. Very specific differences.

[8:27] Lulu Fall: Very, very specific differences. They have a great jazz program. They're not necessarily known for their theater program, even though they have one, but U of M is known obviously among other things, uh, for their excellent musical theater program. So yeah, that's, that's the biggest difference.

[8:42] Jess: Now you were always a performer. When did you start composing?

[8:46] Lulu Fall: Um, well I started composing, of course, you know, having studied just music in college, uh, you had to write your own composition sometimes, but most of the time you had to learn how to dissect music and arrange music. Um, and I'm not a very good arranger, nor do I need that skill necessarily, but I do understand a lot about it. Um, and so had I not gone to Michigan state to study music, I probably wouldn't be a composer. I wouldn't be a songwriter, you know? So, uh, yeah, Michigan state helped shape me for that. But after graduating, you know, I've always had, I've always had, uh, little ditties that I would write from time to time. And I used to write poetry a lot. And a lot of those, a lot of the words from those poems ended up becoming lyrics and, uh, to, you know, songs from the present day that, that I have.

Um, and yeah, I just had a keyboard. I knew a little bit of a little bit, so I just kind of started using like my theory and composition knowledge and applied that to writing my own stuff. And then, you know, fast forward to collaborating with Chris Johnson, who's not only my, my writing partner, but he's also my boyfriend. And we too went to Michigan state together. And, uh, yeah, about five years ago, we, seven years ago, we rekindled our friendship and five years ago, we ended up in a relationship. And so he is a mastermind genius when it comes to composing and arranging. And, uh, so him and I get together a lot and he just shows me a lot more and that just helps just reinforce the things that I learned way back when, and just kind of helps fuel me to continue to write, you know, in the future.

[10:33] Jess: I wish you could see the smile on my face when I heard that you're both a collaborator and like a lover with someone that's so rare. And I find it like just so emotionally rewarding to see it exist.

[10:38] Lulu Fall: Oh man, it does exist. It does exist. It's not, you know, it's not easy, but what is, and all the great things in life are the things that you have to work at the hardest, but that doesn't mean that it has to be extremely difficult. And that doesn't mean that there has to be all this pushback.

[10:58] Lulu Fall: I just mean you got to work a little harder and he's damn worth it. So that's fantastic. And I just want to say your songs are incredible. Like, I love I actually listen and enjoy them like "Fight No Better." "Pretty for a Dark Girl," they are incredible pieces. And you are fabulous.

[11:16] Lulu Fall: Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. That really it means so much to me. It's like these songs come from my soul, you know, like they come from me, every single song that you've heard that belongs to me, it comes from me, you know, and it comes from some type of experience, you know. So it just means a lot that you like it and that you're touched by it. Now, let's talk about how you eventually got to Broadway from after graduation.

[11:46] Lulu Fall: Right. So graduated, I was, you know, doing like some little odd jobs in D.C., but mostly I was just focusing on performing. I did like some Smithsonian live exhibit gigs, which was really, really fun. And then I was actually working in the customer service department at Arena Stage, one of the top prestigious theaters in D.C. And I heard that they were doing like a nationwide search for one of the characters in "Crowns." And so my co-workers, you know, knowing and understanding that I do perform and that I do have a background in musical theater, although at that time it wasn't extensive since it was just high school, you know, they said, oh, my God, you should audition. I was like, no, no, no, no, no. I don't want to do that.

I don't I don't act anymore. They're like, what? Just try it. You know, what do you have to lose? You don't get it. You don't get it. You come back here, you do your work. And I was like, you know what? You're right. And I was there were like over 300 people, I'm telling you, over 300 women narrowed it all the way down to five people, including me. And the whole time I was just like, oh, my God, I have missed this so much. You know, I missed it so much. It just felt so amazing and visceral to just like recite these monologues. It was amazing to like learn choreography on the spot. And back then I was a little more flexible. So, you know, it just came that much more easy for me. And then I get a phone call and I didn't have an agent at the time.

You know, you have to understand that. So I get a phone call from the casting director and he says, Lulu, we really, really want you it's between you and someone else. And that someone else is there in Villanueva. And she is what is she in right now? She's all over the place. I think she's in "Lion King" or something. But yeah, yeah, I love that woman, she's so sweet, but yeah, that was my first time meeting her and he was like, so we want to hire her. We didn't have a budget to have a swing, but we really, really want you. And I was like, you know what? OK, fine. So then, you know, that was the beginning of my career. And then that was over. And, you know, I continue to just I had enough. I had enough gusto to audition for more things.

I was like, well, I opened this damn door already. So it's time to just keep going. Right. And so, again, I was just like learning on the job and auditioning is a job. So auditioning, I'm like keeping my ears and eyes wide open. And then I had a friend of mine, Eric Williams, who's another fantastic actor and singer residing in New York. He was like, hey, Lulu, "Hair" is auditioning. And I was like, "Hair," the tribal love rock musical "Hair"? And he was like, yeah, he was like, you should go to New York and audition. If there's a group of us that's going and I was like, all right, fine. I was like, you know, what's the worst that could happen? And at the time, I believe I was I was a substitute arts teacher.

I just kind of dabbled in teaching music and theater and dance to like little terrible four year olds. And so it was totally fine for me to be like, cough, cough, I'm a little sick. So I took like a few days off. I was like, all right, I'm going to go to New York. So I get there. This is like the best story ever. I get there. Mind you, I know that people see me as the woman with the short red hair. But for 11 years, I had long red dreadlocks. So at the time, I still had long red dreads. And so, you know, I get there. I was like, I know a lot about "Hair." I did the musical in high school, so I know everything about it. That's what I thought at the time. And so I get to this open call because I wasn't union yet.

You know, so I wasn't union yet. I also wasn't represented by an agent. So I get there, you know, I get there like 7:30 a.m. and people are singing. People are putting on makeup and I'm just sitting there. People are stretching, you know, their legs are like way over their heads. And I'm like, are you fucking kidding me? So I just get in the corner and I'm just like staring at people and I see Eric and, you know, the other friends that he brought up and he was like, all right, you know, good luck. This is it. I said, OK. So the monitor comes in the room. And of course, because there's like 10,000 of us says, hey, if you are non-equity, we can't see you at this time. Drop your headshot and resume and, you know, good luck.

By the time I get to the monitor table, dude, like the pile of headshots and resumes was so freaking high. I almost almost didn't drop my headshot and resume because I was like, are you kidding me? Like this cost me money. I'm not about to just drop this in this gigantic pile. But you know what? I was like, you know, I came all the way up here to New York. So I dropped it. I kid you not. Two days later, I'm like in D.C. teaching or something. I got a phone call from casting and they want to see me and I was like me. So back and forth for about two weeks, I went from D.C. to New York auditioning, getting called back every time. I literally would get on the bus to go home when I before I even step off the bus to, you know, to welcome myself to D.C. There's already a phone call or a voicemail on my phone saying, hey, can you come back on such and such day?

So I literally kept having to turn back around every few days. And thankfully, you know, I was living at home with my parents. They were like, Lulu, do your thing. This is what you want to do. You're challenging yourself. Go ahead. See how far you can go. I said, OK, so I finally made it all the way to final callbacks. It was really fun. And I didn't hear anything for like a week. And I was like, man, I really I really thought that I was going to get this because it felt really good in my bones, you know. And then out of nowhere, I got this phone call and I booked a freaking first international tour and I was like, get out of here. Oh, get out of here. And so like that was the beginning of my journey to New York.

I've always wanted to live here, you know, just much like everyone. You're like, oh, I don't have money to live here. You know what I mean? And I'm not just going to uproot myself here and not have money and not have anything secure because this place is it'll eat you alive, you know, it's just so expensive. So, yeah, that was the foot in the door that I needed to come to New York. But it also ignited something in me. You know, it just reminded me that Lulu, you are meant to not only be a singer and songwriter, but you are meant to be an actor. You are meant to dance. You are meant to do these things. You have this, you know, and every every now and again, when I get overwhelmed or when I get really, really nervous about an audition, I just think about how carefree I was when I was auditioning for "Hair."

You know, there was a certain level of ignorance there, too, just because I I didn't know what it was like to audition. Not much, you know, since it was still 2009 when I booked that show. Well, maybe early 2010, you know, maybe a year had elapsed. But, you know, yeah, I was still like bright eyed and bushy tailed and super duper excited and just like throwing myself into the material. And so any time I get nervous, you know, before, you know, auditioning for something, especially if it's Broadway or something big, I just yank myself back to how I felt. You know, 10, 10, nine years ago, alive, I felt free. I felt like I could do this. And if I can't, I'm going to damn learn. And that's the beginning of my journey into professional theater and more specifically Broadway, because that was my first that was my first Broadway show.

[19:45] Lulu Fall: That is a really inspiring story that's literally started from the bottom. Now you're here in a way.

[19:49] Lulu Fall: Yeah, it started from the bottom to the left somewhere. You know, it's like now.

[19:56] Andrew: Yeah. I'm sorry.

[19:57] Lulu Fall: No, no, no, no. I'm just excited. I wanted to talk. There was something you really wanted to talk about. And I really want to hear your opinion on because as a cis white male, I wish I had more ability to understand it and be more aware of it and I want to learn more about it. So you wanted to talk about typecasting.

[20:16] Lulu Fall: Oh, yeah. And diversity on the stage, which is both two things that I really want to learn about, especially from the point of view of someone who's done it.

[20:28] Lulu Fall: Yes, yes, yes, for sure. I will say I think, you know, especially since I've just had like such an unconventional relationship to theater that and obviously, you know, just the way that my voice type is is the way that I think, you know, I don't have a traditional sound and it's totally fine. I have always been interested in the, you know, the quirky shows, the non-traditional stuff, the very nuanced, you know, cool stuff. And I'm very, very lucky to have done just about every single show that I've done. It's been very diverse, you know. So, again, my experience has been completely different. However, that doesn't mean that I don't see that things are just so so homogenous, you know, and it just makes me sad because we live in New York City where in one city block you will see like a myriad of colors and creeds and and races.

Why can't that be represented on stage? And it just really, really irks me because there are what I don't know. Well, I'm not even going to begin to guess, but there are so many Broadway shows in one season. Why is it that two, possibly three, three tops and that's even probably pushing it. Why is it that there are probably two to three shows per season that are mostly black? And so you have, you know, all of us black.

[21:57] Lulu Fall: Coming out of the woodwork, clamoring to get a job, otherwise we have to settle for possibly being some token in a show. Now things are changing with Hadestown, with Natasha Pierre and the Great Comet of 1812, with Hamilton, so many things are changing and many other shows, I just can't think of any other shows off the top of my head and I'm happy that, you know, Great Comet was a red-headed stepchild and we helped pave the way to have, you know, these people who subscribe to see the shows, not even from subscribers to producers to theater owners to writers, you know, we just kind of like began the conversation of challenging people's lens and making them open up just a little bit, you know.

Why can't a Russian Countess be not only African-American but dark-skinned? She can, you know, and I just love that, I love that so much. Now as far as typecasting goes, because I am slim and because I am a dark-skinned woman and you know, curvy, slim, whatever, for some reason I get typecast as a slut and I don't know why. And it's so funny because at first I was like, oh my God, that means they think that I'm pretty or that I have sex appeal and then I was like, wait, wait, wait, Lulu, sorry, it's getting a little loud here. I was like, wait, wait, wait. I know, it's obvious you're in New York. Oh my God, yeah, I'm like, where is this coming from, it was so quiet, but yeah, and then it dawned on me that, oh no, no, this is beyond what I think about myself, you know, and how this I believe complements me, no, this is happening with many African-American women.

That's all, I can only speak for African-American women, I can't speak for, you know, other non-white women or even white women. I know that we all get typecast, especially as women, you know, why does the heavyset person have to be funny or unattractive, you know? Why does the black woman have to be steeped in some type of stereotype? Why can't I just be the quirky chick next door, you know, because I am, I actually am, so you know, I just want-

[24:19] Jess: I love that.

[24:20] Lulu Fall: Yeah, I just want these writers and these directors, these creatives, these producers and all of the above. I just want all these people to just challenge themselves just a little bit, and to be honest, I think that in addition to, you know, just removing all these stereotypes and just having more inclusion and diversity, you know, with race, color, gender and whatnot, I do think that creative teams also need to diversify, because if I'm going in to audition for something that talks about some type of African-American experience, and then I go into the room and it's a table full of white people, there's a problem, because that's happened too many times, you know? And then, you know, there's just so many things that get lost in translation, you know? And so, that's my rant. My rant's over.

[25:10] Jess: That's a great rant, and as a writer, have you ever thought about writing your own musical and like, maybe producing it, or maybe foreshadowing something?

[25:20] Lulu Fall: No, I will say, I don't know how to- I don't even know how to begin to write a book. Now, if someone comes up to me and is like, I need help with music and lyrics, depending on the piece, absolutely, I can definitely flex that muscle, you know? That hasn't happened yet, but yeah, aside from that, I don't know that I can write my own musical. I don't think that I have that skill set.

[25:46] Jess: Oh, well, that's a shame, because I think you would make a fabulous musical. Like, listening to your music, I'm like, there's a storyteller there.

[25:57] Lulu Fall: Oh, yeah, I definitely tell stories, you know? And I love it. I love it so much. I'm good at telling stories in that way, which is why, yes, I would totally be fine being like, on the music department team of creatives.

[26:14] Jess: I'd be way more comfortable in that realm, for sure.

[26:19] Lulu Fall: Hopefully that'll happen soon.

[26:20] Jess: I would definitely challenge myself in that regard, you know?

[26:25] Lulu Fall: Well, you know I'd be the first to buy a ticket.

[26:28] Jess: So, as we're wrapping up, I do have a few final questions that I have. The first one is, what advice would you give to young women, men, or anyone out there that are interested in becoming where you are and being the next Lulu Fall, specifically women and men of color, because they have a little bit of a different road to walk than me, cis, white guy.

[26:53] Lulu Fall: Yeah, yeah, for sure, and thank you for acknowledging that. I would say, find a mentor, first and foremost. Find a mentor, someone that you can confide in, someone that, you know, can walk you through the ropes. I didn't quite have that until later, but having someone in your corner to just kind of help you out and just give you like a broad spectrum of what it is that you're specifically trying to get into, that will help so much. Also, go. Just go for it. You know, fall down, make those mistakes, get up, and be bold. Keep being bold. Keep pushing. Keep going. That's what got me here, is being bold, you know? Sure, you know, there's fear involved and uncertainty and all that stuff. It's okay, because we're human, but as long as you are putting one step in front of the other and being bold and you are pushing, pushing yourself, and staying true to yourself, but pushing yourself.

Also, be a sponge. Soak it up and soak it in. All of the things that you like to, all of the things that you want to be a part of, you know, whether it's a straight theater, straight plays, whether it's a musical theater, whether it's music, whether it's dancing, or whatever art form, whatever medium. Do your research. Go see plays. Go see shows. Go see these things that you really want to be a part of and soak it up. I think that would be like my most, those are like my most three concrete things, pieces of advice.

[28:18] Jess: Okay. Well, that's great.

[28:20] Lulu Fall: Okay, one more thing before I let you leave and let you promote some of your stuff. What is next for Lulu Fall? What's coming next? Promote yourself. What is next for Lulu Fall? Let us know what the journey is headed.

[28:31] Lulu Fall: Okay. As far as acting goes, you know, still auditioning, still on the grind, you know, I'm sure something will come up soon. As far as music goes, I do have a new album. It's my first solo album in 10 years. Man, 2009. Jeez. Everything happened in 2009, didn't it? Damn.

[28:51] Jess: Big year for you.

[28:53] Lulu Fall: Yeah. 10 years later, I'm releasing not only my first solo album in 10 years, but it's my first ever concept album. And it's called Between Two Worlds. That's going to be released later this year, excuse me, I believe in November. And as far as the concept goes, just to give you a brief overview, it's an album about extremes, personality extremes, extremes in content, and sonic extremes. And the basis of these extremes is me being first generation African American. And when I was younger, I didn't quite feel American enough for my American friends. At times, I didn't feel African enough for my African family. And my way of trying to cope with these, quote unquote, misgivings, my way of trying to appease the masses and to desperately fit in was to create extremes in various parts of my life, all subconsciously.

And so this album is just kind of like a journey into not only the musical influences and the situations that I put myself in, but it gives you a journey into my brain and my way of thinking and talk about storytelling. This album is about letting your freak flag fly. It's okay to be different, and it's okay to be confused about it, and it's okay to create all these crazy extremes. But just know that you are this person for a reason, and it's pretty dope.

[30:24] Jess: Mmm!

[30:25] Lulu Fall: And... Sorry, I just squealed. So Between Two Worlds is coming out later this year. I'm super duper excited. I also entered the Tiny Desk Contest, and I got an email saying that tomorrow they will be announcing the winner. I hope it's me. If it's not, that's fine too. So keep your fingers crossed for that. I'm performing tonight. Have you ever heard of the So Far series? It's like this underground music concert series.

[30:55] Jess: I've heard of it, but I don't quite know the specifics.

[30:57] Lulu Fall: Oh, okay. Well, I am performing in that tonight. And where am I? I'm at 444 Park Avenue between like 31st and 32nd, East 31st and 32nd. I'm also going to be performing in Detroit in the next couple of months with my band, with Chris, my boyfriend, and our band. And I am slowly, slowly trying to put the beginnings of a tour together to promote this new album. So I'm pretty busy. And also, when your album drops later this year, feel free, like we will happily have you back on the show to talk about it, promote it as much as you want.

[31:33] Jess: Oh my goodness, I would love that.

[31:37] Lulu Fall: We'd love to have you chat about it.

[31:39] Jess: I would love that.

[31:40] Lulu Fall: Well, is there anything else you want to say before we wrap up?

[31:47] Lulu Fall: Thanks for listening, guys. And don't judge me too much. I know that my story is very, very, very unconventional, but that is absolutely who I am. And I'm sure that my story is going to affect someone else because everyone has these different ways of kind of getting thrown into this business. And this was my specific cookie cutter path into this business. So thanks for listening.

[32:16] Jess: Well, that was wonderful. Thanks for coming on. I can say personally, and I can only speak for myself, it touched me a lot. There was a lot of times where I just had this big derpy smile on my face the entire time. So I'm just very happy that you gave me your time, told me your story, and shared with me. It was really a wonderful experience, and I really appreciate it.

[32:34] Lulu Fall: Hey, listen. It was my absolute pleasure, and I would love, love, love to be back on your show any time. And I will take you up on that 100%.

[32:41] Jess: All right. Well, thank you guys for listening. I appreciate you, Lulu, for joining us, and we'll see you next time on Musicals with Cheese.