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[0:00] Alan Seales: Welcome to The Theatre Podcast. Happy 2023, if I haven't already said that to you. Happy New Year.

[0:14] Alan Seales: Our guest today is Justin Robertson, aka Squigs, who, if you're familiar with Broadway at all, or even West End or theatre in other regions of the world, you probably have seen his caricatures, his illustrations, also one of the masterminds behind the Lights of Broadway cards. So for all you super collectors out there, this is going to be a great treat for you. He started out wanting to be an actor. He still performs, actually, but spends the majority of his time as an illustrator, just because he's got so much talent. It's actually incredible just to watch him work. He is the guy known for making these theatre-related illustrations these days, and he's got this new project now in Grand Central that you're going to hear all about, that he'll tell you this story.

It's all about squash, and they're actually setting up a squash court in Grand Central Station. If you're going to come by and be here anytime between January 18th and 26th, I want to go check it out. It's a squash court in the middle of Grand Central. Should be cool. All right. So as always, find me online, Instagram, Twitter, TikTok, you know the drill. Leave a rating, leave a review, tell your friends. It's how the word spreads. It's how the podcast grows. And everybody now, please enjoy this episode with Squigs. My guest today is an acclaimed illustrator and caricaturist specializing in capturing the ephemeral, I love that word, collaborative art form of theatre. He has been hailed by the New York Times as one of the "Line King's Heirs," carrying on the theatrical caricature traditions exemplified by legendary Times artist Al Hirschfeld.

His illustrations have been seen regularly since 2010 as the Broadway Ink feature on Broadway.com. They've also appeared in the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, the Los Angeles Times, Variety, the Playbill Broadway Yearbook, Jennifer Ashley Tepper's Untold Stories of Broadway series, and in promotional campaigns for Actors' Equity, Broadway Cares, Equity Fights AIDS, the Theatre World Awards, and theatrical productions in New York, London, and, you know, the rest of the world. He co-created the Lights of Broadway cards and designed and still designs every single card to this day. Justin Robertson, a.k.a. Squigs. Welcome to The Theatre Podcast. Hi there. How you doing? Oh, my goodness. My hands are tired cramping up just thinking about all of that. I've been a little busy, I guess.

[2:44] Justin Robertson: Well, I actually want to start with the Lights of Broadway cards because I think they're incredible. For those who don't know, they're like trading cards, baseball trading cards or comic book cards, whatever, for theatre, for Broadway, and you have individual cards for actors, actresses, for shows, you do special events. I just don't know where this idea came from because it's phenomenal and there are whole sections at theatre cons, Broadway con and other similar ones, there's whole groups, there's this passionate group of people who do nothing but trade these cards all day long and they want the rare ones and there's holograms and all sorts of stuff. So back it up, where did this idea even come from?

[3:30] Justin Robertson: Oh, sure. Well, it kind of goes back to meeting our mutual friend, Dory Berenstein. For many years, I've taken part in the Broadway Cares Equity Fights AIDS flea market that happens in September, typically every year. I would just sell artwork there and help raise money for the cause. Dory's kids came by my booth one time and bought some prints. They took them home. Their dad, Mitchell, saw them and contacted me about doing a commission for Dory's birthday that year. And so Dory got her the present and then she invited me to lunch just to chat about projects. And so we went to lunch at Sardi's.

[4:08] Justin Robertson: Like you do.

[4:09] Alan Seales: Like you do. And really, honestly, one of the first things we both kind of brought to the table was the idea of trading cards for Broadway, both of us having collected baseball cards as kids and that sort of thing. And it's been done over the years. I mean, Playbill has had some, you know, they used to put out cards with each show's key art on it. Different shows have used it for promotional purposes like Newsies and Tuck Everlasting and that sort of a thing. But yeah, it really hadn't been done in kind of an extensive format. And so we started kicking around ideas. I worked on a design and we came out with our first kind of a small edition in the summer of 2015 and started selling them online and in the stores like a theater circle on 44th.

And yeah, and then also just kicking them off that September at the flea market. And that was a time when a lot of kids were on Broadway. It was like School of Rock was in rehearsals. Matilda was going. King and I was going up at Lincoln Center. So just a lot of kids, a lot of kids on Broadway. And it was one of those things where, you know, we had them available at the flea market that year. And Dory and I were both there. And especially the School of Rock kids, they started like buying up multiple packs and then screaming out when they got cards, you know, like my favorite. And I had to, I had to turn away and like tears came to my eyes because one kid goes, I got Stephen Sondheim. He's the king.

And I was like, this is the coolest thing. And they kept like grabbing people, walking by and saying, buy some packs so we can trade with you. You know, it was one of those, one of those things when I think both Dory and I just looked at each other and we're like, oh, this, this is something, you know, and, and we're so grateful for those kids, including our, our pal, Ian Armitage, who plays young Sheldon on the, on the TV. He also kind of blew up our social media there at the beginning when he was just doing his theater, you know, his theater reviews. But, but yeah, that's grown into a big group of folks that, that collect the cards regularly and we call them light catchers. They're Lights of Broadway, light catchers.

And, and they're all over the country and, and they're actually, you know, people who have met each other through cards, either through trading online or coming to Broadway con and meeting up for, you know, trading sessions. And, and, you know, a lot of them will come into town and they'll all go see a show together and, and that sort of a thing. So it's, it's really, it's, it's become really kind of a fun community, you know, thing. So we're, we're very, we're very happy with, with how that's gone.

[6:36] Alan Seales: That is so cool. And, and I think you, you failed to mention one of the important things is that most of the profit all goes back to charity, right?

[6:40] Justin Robertson: Well, a lot of the profit does. Yeah. We have, you know, in addition to, you know, Broadway Cares and the Entertainment Community Fund, formerly known as Actors Fund, those are kind of regular beneficiaries of, of some of our, some of our profits. But we also have what's called the Giving Back Program. And it's each edition for now, I think probably like eight or nine editions. We've asked some various Broadway stars to pick a charity that they, that they love. And then we make a special limited edition numbered and signed card of them. You know, some, some of the profits from those, from the sales of those go to their charity. And we've had so many great charities over the years. Well, obviously Broadway Cares and Entertainment Community Fund, but charities having to do it like Cancer Support Community with Jason Danieli and Marin Mazzi, Covenant House has been the choice of, of a number of, of performers.

Planned Parenthood, The Trevor Project. Currently in the, we can talk about this in a bit, but we have a new edition that just came out in early December this last year. And in this edition, our Giving Back stars are Adrienne Warren, Bonnie Milligan, Gavin Creel and Joshua Henry on one card, Lilius White, Patrick Page and Harvey Fierstein. So it's fun that those, a bunch of those cards go into packs and those can be found if, you know, you know, anywhere anyone collects these cards. And then we hold a number of them back for fundraising purposes. Like if there's a, an auction or a, you know, some sort of a very special, you know, giveaway type, type situation, but yeah, that's been fun.

[8:21] Alan Seales: How long does it take you to, to draw? Like once you have the idea, if you're like, all right, I'm going to go draw this brand new person who just made their debut in Ann Juliet or something, right? Like how long does it take you to decide what you're going to draw?

[8:25] Justin Robertson: Um, well, it, it honestly depends on, you know, what, what the final product, final aim is. If it's, if it's like, uh, the cards with, um, I kind of call them headshot cards, you know, it was basically like head, head and shoulders type drawings that'll, you know, that can take me just a really short time. You know, my process is to, you know, to pencil and ink up and that's traditional and then scan it into Photoshop and then do the coloring and assembly. Uh, there one, one thing that I did, I threw myself a curve ball in this new edition. Um, because, uh, on each of the headshot cards, um, I've put a space, a couple spaces for, since I've done a lot of drawings of a lot of these people that are on these cards, there is a space for like shows that I've drawn them in.

So, uh, you know, for instance, if it's, Christian Borle has a card in this, in this edition. And, um, uh, I think I have in the sidebars are my drawings from, uh, Peter and the Star Catcher. And I want to say something rotten. I'm not, I don't remember exactly which one that was, but so, you know, it kind of, it's, it's a way also in addition to kind of decorating the card more, um, it, it's a way to kind of utilize the, you know, the work that I've already done over the, over the years. So.

[9:37] Alan Seales: Oh, that's so cool. Yeah. That's really neat to be able to throw back to that. And, you know, if you ever run out of content, which I don't think will ever happen, it can always go backwards in time from 2015 and go, you know, you can do like Tony, Tony winning special hologram cards or something. Tony winners. That's, that's my idea. You can have that.

[9:53] Justin Robertson: Oh, thank you. Thank you. Well, the hologram cards you're talking about, those are, it's a, it's a thing called lenticulars and they're like, we call them tilt cards where, you know, there's, um, three images on each card and you tilt it and it changes. Uh, and we do have various, you know, various methods we use for those. But in this edition, we have six of those, uh, in our, in this current edition, one is themed around six, the musical. Um, we also have one that's, uh, Patti LuPone's, uh, some of her key roles. We have 10 Pulitzer prize winning musicals over the years. Obviously that was kind of inspired by a strange loop getting, being the 10th. We have a Sondheim celebration, which is kind of a static image of him, but like the background changes with all the different shows that I've drawn of his over the years. Oh, that's cool.

[10:36] Justin Robertson: Yeah. We have a, we have a Milky white card, you know, since that seemed to be one of the, one of the standout, the standout performances of this last year. And then, and then we have, Oh, the, um, uh, celebrating understudies, you know, we kind of took, um, took a, uh, informal poll among some of people's favorite understudy and swing and standby performances, uh, over the years. And so, you know, we have, uh, you know, everyone from, uh, Shirley McClain to, you know, um, Megan Mullally in Greece and, uh, to, you know, Max Clayton and, um, you know, some of the, the great folks who have been keeping shows open recently. So, so yeah, it's, it's fun to, you know, kind of just keep a, keep a finger on the pulse of what's going on and try to reflect that in, uh, in what we put out in the cards. We're going to take a short break. Stay tuned for more of the episode.

[11:31] Alan Seales: So you were born and raised in Oregon, which naturally lends itself to drawing and Broadway, of course. So, so I guess as a, as a kid though, like you, how long were you in Oregon before moving to LA? Is that correct?

[11:44] Justin Robertson: Yeah. Yeah. No, I was, I was in, uh, I was, uh, 18 when I left, uh, moved to LA and went to college and in Southern California. And then I was there for almost 20 years before I moved to New York and moved to New York in 2010. Um, Oregon is, you know, it's, it's funny cause you

[12:01] Alan Seales: Welcome back to The Theatre Podcast. I’m your host, Alan Seales, and today I’m thrilled to have Justin "Squigs" Robertson with me. Squigs is an acclaimed illustrator and caricaturist known for capturing the essence of the theatre world.

[12:20] Alan Seales: Squigs, you’ve made quite a name for yourself in the Broadway community. Can you tell us a bit about your journey and how you got started in illustration?

[12:35] Justin Robertson: Thanks for having me, Alan! My journey started in Oregon, where I grew up. My dad was an artist in his own right; he could create and fix almost anything, which really inspired me. I always had a natural ability to draw, but I never thought it would lead me to a career in theatre illustration. After spending some time in LA, I eventually made my way to New York City, where I began acting and supplementing my income with my illustrations.

[13:05] Alan Seales: That’s fascinating! It sounds like your background in acting really informs your work as an illustrator. How do you think your experiences on stage influence your illustrations?

[13:20] Justin Robertson: Absolutely! Being an actor gives me a unique perspective when I’m illustrating. I understand the nuances of performance and the emotions that come with it. I try to capture that ephemeral quality of theatre in my work, which is what makes it so special.

[13:40] Alan Seales: You’ve been compared to the legendary Al Hirschfeld. How does that feel, and what do you think sets your work apart?

[13:55] Justin Robertson: It’s an incredible honor to be compared to someone like Hirschfeld. He was a master of capturing the spirit of Broadway. I think what sets my work apart is my focus on the collaborative nature of theatre. I love illustrating not just the stars but also the behind-the-scenes people who make the magic happen.

[14:20] Alan Seales: That’s a great perspective. You’ve also co-created the Lights of Broadway trading cards. Can you tell us more about that project?

[14:35] Justin Robertson: Sure! The Lights of Broadway trading cards celebrate the incredible talent in the theatre community. Each card features a different performer or creative, and it’s a fun way to highlight the diversity and richness of Broadway. It’s been a joy to work on and connect with so many talented individuals.

[14:55] Alan Seales: It sounds like a fantastic project! You also illustrated a cookbook titled "Give My Swiss Chards to Broadway." How did that come about?

[15:10] Justin Robertson: That was a fun collaboration with Gideon Glick and Adam D. Roberts. They wanted to create a cookbook that combined their love for Broadway and cooking, and I was thrilled to contribute my illustrations. It’s filled with humor and delicious recipes, and it’s a unique way to celebrate both passions.

[15:35] Alan Seales: I love that! It’s such a creative intersection. What do you enjoy most about working in the theatre community?

[15:50] Justin Robertson: The sense of camaraderie is incredible. Everyone is passionate about their craft, and there’s a shared understanding of the challenges and triumphs that come with it. I love being part of a community that values creativity and collaboration.

[16:10] Alan Seales: That’s beautifully said. As someone who’s deeply embedded in the theatre world, what advice would you give to aspiring illustrators or artists looking to break into this field?

[16:25] Justin Robertson: My advice would be to stay true to your voice and keep creating. Don’t be afraid to put your work out there, and connect with others in the community. Networking is key, and you never know where a conversation might lead. Also, be open to collaboration; it can lead to amazing opportunities.

[16:50] Alan Seales: Great advice! Thank you so much for sharing your insights today, Squigs. It’s been a pleasure having you on the show.

[17:05] Justin Robertson: Thank you, Alan! It’s been a joy to chat with you.

[24:02] Alan Seales: And I think it's like the one time a year that they allow these kind of banners to hang there, which is kind of odd. But that's true. It's an international tournament that the four top finishers from last year, two were from Egypt, one was from Peru, and one is American. We're going to take a short break. Stay tuned for more of the episode.

[24:28] Alan Seales: Is one able to trademark an illustration style? Like, Larson, what's Jim Larson? Gary Larson, who drew the Farside comics. Yeah, so you can look at a Farside and be like, Oh, that's I know that that's the thing or the style of Garfield, you know, that sort of thing. Like when I see your work out in the wild, I'm like, that's the squigs. I know squigs is, you know, like, definitely I know your style. Are you is that legally permissible to people do that? Or I mean, often imitated, never duplicated? How's that all work?

[25:04] Justin Robertson: Well, I think it's and I don't think you can like you, you can trademark a style. I mean, because honestly, everyone's style is kind of a, you know, it's it's like, influences, times, particular mindset and upbringing. And, you know, it's a combination of a lot of, you know, things, you know, I mean, with my work, it's like, I obviously, over the years have, like, tried to pay tribute to Al Hirschfeld, who's, you know, kind of, you know, the the be all and end all when it comes to entertainment caricature, but I really tried to make something my own. There's also an amazing contemporary of, of Hirschfeld, who's also passed since but Sam Norkin, who, I think my work kind of mimics his style a bit more, it's a bit more, you know, pointy angles, and, you know, a bit more geometric, and, Al's grasp of anatomy and stuff kind of comes through a bit more and mine's a bit more stylized kind of a thing.

Yeah, I think with when it comes to styles, people, you know, you know, they just say, you know, borrow or steal from the best, you know, and while everyone wants to, you know, have their own, their own voice, you know, as it were, you know, it's, it's, you can always say that someone has been influenced by someone else. So I think, you know, it pays tribute to, to the grace that came before you, and you're laying the path for those who come after you.

[26:22] Alan Seales: And have you had others that have shown you their work or tried to, to, like, draw yours? I imagine there could be like a whole contest that Lights of Broadway could do right of like, draw your version of this set of cards or whatever it is, right?

[26:36] Justin Robertson: Yeah, no, it's true. I have, you know, I have been approached by people that, you know, especially I love when people, you know, email me or message me and, and just ask for, for their, you know, for, you know, any advice or they want to show me something and, and I'm like, oh, yeah, cool. Yeah, I love that. I love being able to, I mean, obviously, it's an honor when someone thinks that I'm, you know, worthy of, of getting my, you know, opinion on something. So I don't take that for granted. Yeah, it's, it's a, it's a funny, funny world. And, you know, I think some, some of my approach to this is kind of, I just, I never want to stop learning. You know, I, a few years back, I, I saw that there was a class being given at the School of Visual Arts here in town.

And by an illustrator that I very much admire, Steve Brodner, who's kind of his, his kind of main claim to fame is he's a, like a political illustrator, but he's also, he's, he's a fantastic caricaturist. And, and so I took a couple of, of, of classes from, from him. And, you know, we just, we just hit it off and it was, it was great. It was one of those moments where I'm like, oh man, I've admired this guy's work for so long. And now I'm, you know, we're drawing in the same room and he's had me back to chat to some of those other classes and, and, and stuff. I'm getting ready to, to take a, like a, like just a two hour intensive class, the Society of Illustrators, which is being, which is featuring James McMullen, a well-known poster artist for Lincoln Center.

And, and so there's a bit of a drawing session and stuff. And it's, it's an excuse for me to meet him because I, I just admire that guy's work so much. His work over the years is just legendary. And so, yeah, you know, I just, I try to keep shoving stuff in my brain and seeing what comes out.

[28:17] Alan Seales: Oh, I highly respect that. That's, that's something that I, I want to continue to do as well, just for a purely biological reason of trying to make sure my brain doesn't calcify as I age, right? Because if you stop trying to learn, then your brain lets you stop trying to learn. You literally lose the ability to do that. So total respect for, for all of that. And I feel like, I feel like people in the creative industry too, are less likely to probably fall into that trap anyway, because you have to break your routine all the time to, to try new things and to sometimes stay relevant or like you're doing the same overall motion you're illustrating, but like the shows, the shows are always changing and the casts are always changing and the movements are always changing and the charities are always, are always changing.

So like, you're still, you're still illustrating, but you can always learn something new and add, you know, add something different to, to something you've already been perfecting for so long. There's never an end.

[29:13] Justin Robertson: Yeah, no, it's very true. And, and, you know, I'm kind of at the point where, you know, I've been in New York for, for, well, in May, it'll be 13 years doing a lot of the same work, you know, type of work over and over again. And so I'm trying to find ways to, to mix it up. So I, you know, one, one thing that was, that recently happened and it was a kind of a born from the pandemic, but I illustrated a cookbook called, called Give My Swiss Charge to Broadway. And it's authored by, yeah, yeah, right. It's, it's, it's Dad Joke Central. It's great. I love it. I love it. And the, the recipes were written by esteemed food writer, Adam Roberts. And, and the, the copy, the, you know, the facts and the fun stuff about the show were collaborated, it was written by Gideon Glick. And, and then I did the illustration for 50 recipes and that just came out this last, this last fall.

[30:05] Alan Seales: So what's that called?

[30:07] Justin Robertson: Give My Swiss Charge to Broadway.

[30:08] Alan Seales: Yeah, right. Okay.

[30:09] Justin Robertson: So, and it features recipes such as Chicken Breast Side Story, Little Chop of Horrors, The Clam's Visit.

[30:19] Alan Seales: Please tell me more.

[30:21] Justin Robertson: Ham Stilton.

[30:23] Alan Seales: Oh my God. Okay. There will be a link for this book in the show notes. Go there now, get this book. And I need it just for the dad jokes because-

[30:30] Justin Robertson: Oh, it's, it's great. And it's full of it. And also each, each recipe comes with a listening guides, you know, stuff that you can put on, you know, the stereo or the, you know, your MP3 player, whatever the kids are listening to these days. And, you know, like for instance, if you're, if you're doing Little Chop of Horrors, like the playlist will be additional stuff by Ashwin and Mankin that you can listen to, or, you know, it's really, it's really super fun.

[30:53] Alan Seales: Funion Home.

[30:55] Justin Robertson: Oh my goodness.

[30:56] Alan Seales: Yeah. It's just a chorus lime pie.

[30:59] Justin Robertson: It's, it's really, it's really fun.

[31:01] Alan Seales: Have you made any of these recipes yourself?

[31:03] Justin Robertson: I haven't, but we had a book launch at, well, we did a book signing at the drama book shop and then we had a kind of an opening night launch party at Joe's pub and someone made Wickedoodles, which are snickerdoodles, it's themed from Wicked, and one of the key ingredients is matcha tea. So it's like, so the, the cookies come out green.

[31:29] Alan Seales: Oh my goodness.

[31:29] Justin Robertson: And they also have a, I'll have a bit of a caffeine kick. So it was, it was very tasty.

[31:34] Alan Seales: Were you endorsed by something like Lin Manuel, my ham, duh, or something, right?

[31:39] Justin Robertson: You know.

[31:39] Alan Seales: Yeah. Well, the whole thing started and it was because of a tweet. It was Gideon who, who tweeted out something like, it was writing a kid's book about Bernadette writing a kid's book about Bernadette pizza or something, you know, it was, and, and so I think he and he and Adam knew each other, but they connected based on that. And I just tweeted back. I just said, Hey, let me illustrate this. And, and that's then, you know, it was months later that I got an email from, from Gideon saying, Hey, we're thinking about making this a cookbook. And, you know, would you be interested in, you know, working up some illustrations for it? At that time it was just pitching it to publishers. And so we did a six recipes, you know, that kind of fully realized recipes. And, and I put together a, you know, kind of a mock-up of what, you know, the book could, or the pages could look like kind of a thing and eventually landed a, a publisher. And so, yeah.

[32:39] Alan Seales: So cool. All right. I'm totally getting that book. So let's, yeah, let's wrap this up with three questions. I ask everyone to end the episodes. The first one just very simply is what motivates you.

[32:44] Justin Robertson: Wow. Like my first word that came to mind was creation. That's so like, so it's cool, you know, but you know, it's, it's like, you know, you know, making something, you know, whether or not something is that I'm putting out there has been done before or not. It's something that's done in a fresh way, you know, by me just because, you know, it's my hand and my pen and, or pixels that are, that are making something. But yeah, the art of creation, I think is, is it's something that, you know, that it, you know, also celebrating creation is a, is a big thing for me. I love the collaboration of, of theater and just how many people, you know, make up the, you know, the fabric of what ultimately is seen on stage. And then also the fabric of the, the, the contribution of the audience to that, you know, just live theaters, there's nothing like it.

[33:37] Alan Seales: Oh, I love that. What advice would you give to your younger self and younger people listening now starting out down a similar path?

[33:41] Justin Robertson: Wow. I would, I think I would say, pay attention more. I think, you know, sometimes, you know, especially when your young life is just going by so quickly and you know, everyone's absorbing information and all kinds of things as fast as they can. But I think that kind of the key to any creative endeavor is, is really paying attention. It's keeping your eyes and ears open, seeing what works and seeing, and remind or learning or reminding yourself of where something has come from. You know, it's, you know, if you're, if you're preparing to do a role and there's a word that you have, you're not familiar with, look it up. You know, if there's an artist that you like, you know, look up as much of their work as possible and like learn where they were influenced from, you know, and that sort of a thing. So I think it's just, you know, be, be curious is kind of, is probably what I would say. Be more curious.

[34:45] Alan Seales: All right. Last question then, if you can only see one show for the rest of your life, but you can see it as many times as you want, what would you say?

[34:49] Justin Robertson: That's, that's, that's a tricky one. I'm sure you, everyone says that. But I'm such a Sondheim nut and there's just such a wealth in each, you know, each of his pieces in it, you know, between, I think it would be between Sunday in the Park with George in the cookbook, Sunday in the Pork with George, or Sweeney Todd, which also in the cookbook, Weenie Todd's.

[35:17] Alan Seales: Weenie Todd's, yeah.

[35:18] Justin Robertson: Weenie Todd's, yes. But between Sweeney Todd and Sunday in the Park with George, those are kind of my thing. I would probably lean a bit towards Sunday, you know, just, it kind of, it's a show that kind of speaks to, you know, both of my creative worlds. So I think that's probably it.

[35:31] Alan Seales: That's brilliant. All right. You can get more of me in episodes like this at thetheaterpodcast.com. I'm on Instagram, TikTok, Twitter, Facebook, it's all out there. Listen and follow the podcast, leave a rating and a review wherever you're listening now. Thank you to Jukebox the Ghost for the intro and outro music and Squigs, man, this has been so much fun. We've been like passing each other in circles for so long and we've never gotten sat down and like really talk. I love this.

[35:55] Justin Robertson: I love it. Thank you so much for having me. This is great.