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[0:01] Alan Seales: Welcome back to the Theatre Podcast, intimate personal conversations with the industry's biggest names. As always, I'm your host, Alan Seales, and our wonderful, wonderful guest today is a longtime friend of mine, Ilana Levine, who is just this amazing human. And I've been working with her off and on for years in various podcasting projects, and we've always talked about having her on my podcast, and we were going to do it, and then the pandemic hit, and things just went haywire, but now we actually made it happen. So I am really excited to share this conversation with you. And full disclosure, it's actually kind of awkward for me to interview people that I already know. I don't quite know why.

I don't quite know why that is, but we had a good time anyway. I actually have a much easier time asking weird questions to people I don't know. So take that for whatever it means. I don't know. Find me on all the socials. Leave a rating and a review wherever you're listening now. And everybody, please enjoy this episode with Ilana Levine.

[1:10] Alan Seales: My guest today may be best known to my musical theater audience for her role as Lucy Van Pelt in the Broadway revival of the musical You're a Good Man, Charlie Brown. She also starred in the Broadway production of Jake's Women, Wrong Mountain, and The Last Night of Ballyhoo. In addition to performing at the Tony Awards and her amazing guest appearance on the infamous episode of Seinfeld called The Contest, she has appeared in many television shows and films, including Law & Order, Tanner on Tanner, Damages, Failure to Launch, The Nanny Diaries, Friends with Kids, Five Fights Up, and so many more. I got to stop now or I'd be here all day. In May of 2016, she joined the podcast universe when she began hosting Little Known Facts with Ilana Levine. And she also hosts the podcast called And the Award Goes To and How to Be More Chill for the Broadway Podcast Network. I already gave it away. Ilana Levine, welcome to the Theatre Podcast.

[2:00] Ilana Levine: Alan, I've been waiting. I've been waiting and waiting for this invitation. And finally, it has happened. Thank you.

[2:11] Alan Seales: You're welcome. I'm so happy to have you here. I remember like we talked about this pre-pandemic and then the world went to shit. And then we've been working together on the other two podcasts, How to Be More Chill and The Award Goes To for a couple of years now. And so now it's just like, oh, yeah, we never actually made this happen. So here we are. I am so happy to have you in this capacity because we've hung out for a long time. We see shows together. We work together. And now I get to actually sit down with you uninterrupted and learn what makes you tick. I'm so excited.

[2:44] Ilana Levine: I'm so excited. Thank you. Thank you for having me.

[2:47] Alan Seales: Well, little Ilana, take us back to what got you into the theater? What was your touchstone? Do you have a moment when you're like, this is for me, this is where I needed to go here?

[3:00] Ilana Levine: I definitely had a touchstone in terms of this is for me. I will always be the happiest audience member anytime I walk into a theater ever. So my childhood was about the appreciation of the arts. I was in no way someone who performed in the arts. But my family had the great benefit. We lived in New Jersey, so we could drive over the George Washington Bridge and Broadway was right there. And my mom grew up in Brooklyn, was a passionate theater lover. And really like anytime something momentous or glorious happened in our lives, a Broadway show was how we got to celebrate. And this was, you know, it didn't matter what seat it was. And it didn't matter if it were a musical or a straight play. My mother really opened up the world of theater to me.

You know, the reviving Camelot, I keep remembering listening to Camelot on a record in my house. That was one of her favorite, favorite musicals. She saw the original. So my absolute love and awe for the arts and getting to see a Broadway show, that was born out of my mom's infectious passion for it. And then, I mean, I've told the story before, so I'll tell a very truncated version of it. I was getting a haircut when I was about to be a freshman in college. And there was one of the most handsome people cutting my hair and doing a blow dry. And his name was Bruno Rondinelli. And Bruno, when he wasn't like Warren Beatty from shampoo vibes, was writing a play. And he had, you know, in the salon, everyone has their station.

And on his little shelf were, you know, hairbrushes and hair products and this script. And so I guess at some point I picked it up. This was not a girl who'd ever done a play. I didn't know what a Samuel French play would look like. I certainly had read plays in high school and big, you know, anthologies and collections of playwrights. But seeing like a script like this was brand new. And I guess I was in love with Bruno. And to try to, I don't know what I was doing. I started reading his play out loud. And he was excited to hear his words read back to him. And he was like, you know what, you're really good at reading at cold readings did not know what a cold reading was. But I was like, thank you.

And from there, five hours later, I ended up going to his acting studio in New York City that allowed people to audit for free Wednesday nights once a month. This was the Terry Schreiber studios and acting studio in New York City. And that's how it all began. I walked into a room where people were doing emotional recall exercises. And someone did this thing where using like the furniture that you have in an acting class, like, you know, like two cartons to make a couch and something else made a refrigerator. I don't know, she she made a room. And then this girl came out on stage and like business attire. She kind of kept walking on and off the stage coming back in various forms of like, post work clothes, like sweatpants and her blazer.

And then she came back again fully in her like, couch potato clothes, and mimes turning on a TV. And then she goes to the refrigerator that she made out of, you know, cardboard boxes. And from the back of the refrigerator takes a baby bottle and sits on the couch and proceeds to drink from a baby bottle. And that was her I'm sorry, it was a private moment exercise, not an emotional recall private moment. So this was someone sharing with a class that when she comes home after work, her private moment is to drink out of a baby bottle. So A, this was the most amazing thing I've ever seen, right? B, what? And C, the most remarkable part of all of it and many, you know, people did all sorts of things that day.

But I remember listening to the feedback that she got and how the teacher sort of led the conversation. And it was the most empathetic, kind, generous, fascinating post scene work discussion. I mean, I'm 18 years old. I don't I'm from Teaneck. I don't I don't know what's happening, except that I was in a room with the most generous, beautiful people who watch this thing where honestly, I didn't know whether to giggle or cry. I did not know what or get help. Like I didn't know what to do watching this thing. And I very much learned like, that's what it is to be brave. I mean, truly, there are very few more intimate things that anyone could share with a therapist, let alone a room full of strangers, including auditors like me, right? Like it wasn't. Anyway, I could go on and on about that night. And that actress.

[8:32] Ilana Levine: No, but honestly, so Bruno haircut, reading his play that class, everything in my life changed from that moment on. And I didn't know that I was going to end up doing this professionally, but I knew that I wanted to start being in these kinds of rooms.

[8:51] Alan Seales: That's incredible that you just took one. Yeah, one evening of chance after chance, and just went with it. And a fresh college 18 year old, who's gone, who didn't even know you wanted to do this, goes to this class where one of the objectively speaking weirdest things that you could see is happening that night. And instead of running and being like, I don't want anything to do with this, you fully dove in. And so I guess back up a second. Number one, did you and Bruno ever have a moment? Did that ever come to fruition?

[9:31] Ilana Levine: No. So Bruno, Bruno ended up, I don't think I ever, I don't think he came to a class. I know that he still has a salon. And I know that randomly he and a cousin of mine were in some poker tournament recently. And this huge full circle moment happened where I get a text from my cousin saying, you know, I just folded and Bruno Rondinelli, you know, won the pot, something like that. So no, I think he was a real artist. And it turned out that hair artistry became the thing that he committed to. But yeah, and so much happened since then. But needless to say, I was like a marketing business major. And I just everything recalibrated and reshifted. And, and yeah, that's what I was gonna ask you what you were originally going to school for.

[10:24] Alan Seales: So did you did you switch schools? Or you were able to do this?

[10:27] Ilana Levine: I hadn't started, right? It was it was the summer before I was about to start college. I went to orientation at the university that I had been accepted at. And, and as my mom reminds me, I barely remember the story. But like, two hours into orientation, I was like, I'm coming home. This is I'm not going here. And yeah, and so I ended up applying to NYU and Fordham University, Fordham because I had like read somewhere that Denzel Washington and Patricia Clarkson had gone there. I didn't even know it was a Jesuit university and and how beautiful that would be as part of the academics there. And anyway, I got into NYU and I got into Fordham and Fordham helped me financially go to their school. I think they like, Levine, we don't have any of you come on in.

We'll give you and then why he was like, we have 7000 Levines. Anyway, and that ended up being a really remarkable place to go to school as it turned out. And when I came into school, John Hickey was a senior, John Benjamin Hickey. But we had a class together and he became my first friend, like my first actor friend. And to this day remains my most beloved, cherished friend. But yeah, so I ended up studying theater.

[12:04] Alan Seales: I want to jump ahead because you just mentioned John Benjamin Hickey. He's been a guest on And The Award Goes To, which is the podcast that we're currently releasing season three of. And it's fascinating to me when we're talking about like, oh, yeah, I'm just texted. I'm texting Harvey Fierstein. I'm texting Allison Janney. I'm like, you are legitimately friends with all of these people and you've been friends with them for forever.

[12:29] Ilana Levine: Yeah, yeah, decades and decades. And Jason Alexander and all these just amazing people that you've just kept up with. And I guess kind of falling down that path a little bit is, well, I guess in the bio, right? Is texting your passion?

[12:43] Alan Seales: Is texting my passion? Yes. Did you only text? Is that all you ever do?

[12:50] Ilana Levine: Did you text a lot of people? Because you only call me. No.

[12:55] Alan Seales: The thing about it, I guess what I'm getting into is like, you've been fortunate enough to work with such amazing people. And maybe it's, I'm trying to figure out where my question is formulating here, because the people who have been in the business for these decades and for people of a certain age, right, who are still with it, who haven't given up or who haven't gone on to do something else, or even recently left the business during the pandemic. So many people are still such a close-knit community. And I mean, do you see that on your side of the world and in your environment, too? If you're just like, you did You're a Good Man, Charlie Brown with, you know, with BD Wong and Roger Bart and Kristin Chenoweth and Anthony Rapp and Chris and Stanley Mathis, right?

So all of these people went on to such amazing things, yourself included. And I don't know, like, do you see what I'm getting at? All of you sort of moved through this iconic point together and have become these icons in the industry. And is that a club that you realize that was really hard to get into at the time? Is it like looking at kids now starting out of college? Is it different from the way you perceive it?

[14:21] Ilana Levine: You know, I, I only know this, I feel like when you named the people that you just named, I feel like so much of life, you know, everyone talks about success being, you know, preparation and luck coming together. I feel like the luck I've had in my life of being in rooms working with or for however I came to know them, like Allison Janney, I met because we were at a Super Bowl party together in 1988. And I know the year because the show I was shooting at the time was called Tanner 88. And someone in that show brought me to the Super Bowl party. And I met Allison. And when I tell you that the laughter, like, no one, we just laughed. I mean, we because neither of us were interested in football, we just found ourselves like fast friends.

And then very quickly thereafter ended up like we both were moving out to LA and found each other there again and ended up living together. A lot of things happened. When I look back to certain people in my life, I mean, Hickey, I went to school with and Matt McGrath was there and Julie White had graduated from Fordham. By the way, Hickey was at Fordham because Julie White, who was also from Texas, had gone to Fordham. And he was like, oh, that's a college. And you know what I mean? Like he followed her basically to New York City. And Julie White came back to Fordham to do Cabaret with Hickey. He played Cliff after he went on to do it for Sam Mendes on Broadway, obviously, but he I first saw him do Cliff.

And I had to be stage manager because, you know, when you're a theater major, you have to do all the jobs at different points. So I stage managed Julie White and John Benjamin Hickey's production of Cabaret at Fordham University in the late 80s. So I guess what I would say is back in the day, and this is still a thing, I think, although then you were a New York actor who went to L.A. just for pilot season. Now people graduating go right out to L.A. and sort of skip the whole, let's do really off, off, off Broadway shows first in New York before going out to L.A. So we were all on this trajectory of do plays for one penny in New York and then try to go get a pilot in L.A. And so during pilot season, quote unquote, is when I started to get to know or live with for, you know, we would sublet an apartment together.

And I lived with Helen Hunt for one pilot season. And at the time she was going out with Matthew Broderick. And that's how I first met Matthew back in the day. And Alison, as I said, we both went out for pilot season at the same time. So there were sort of two things going on. There were like these displaced New Yorkers who would find themselves out in L.A. and all doing play readings at each other's houses all the time to keep feeling like actors while we went through what we went through. And then Alison called me after her audition for the West Wing and she was like, well, I was terrible. And I was like, oh, honey, I'm sorry. I'm not so terrible, as it turned out.

[17:46] Ilana Levine: Anyway, you know, I think that as you know, as a theater artist yourself, there's something that happens in dressing rooms. I mean, if I thought drinking out of a baby bottle and doing that for others in a room was intimate, that's sort of what it is to be in a dressing room with people. And as someone who has been doing this for a really long time and has done so many plays, I mean, Broadway was just this miraculous place to also get to work. But there's for every Broadway play, there were, you know, 30 plays I did. Naked Angels was a theater company that I got into very early on. And Naked Angels was started and inhabited by people who were not yet famous, like Marissa Tomei and Fisher Stevens and Gina Gershon and our writers.

Oh, and Joe Mantello and John Robin Bates and Warren Light and Kenny Lonergan were our playwrights. Like, so when I look at like the people, like, I can't believe all of those people went on to just write the most incredible plays that are done all over the world. But that's, that was like our, our basement. We were, you know, workshopping Sideman. We were, you know, and then Robbie ends up doing Substance of Fire and Sarah Jessica Parker is in that play and Ron Riffin. So I could go on and on and on. But I also think having been a part of a community in New York of Naked Angels, which was an incredible theater company to be a part of. Yeah. And all of us just really kept supporting each other. That's why I have so many guests that I can get to come on my podcast because that theater company especially was a breeding ground of creativity and friendship and passion.

[19:46] Alan Seales: Do you think that current social media has kind of destroyed that ecosystem a little bit?

[19:52] Ilana Levine: I don't know, because as you know, every time we do a podcast and you and I have done a million things together, I'm still looking for like the unmute button. Like I am so not intuitive. And you can tell neither are my friends because we'll have like, you know, the Judith Lights and people like that on and I'm like, Alan, you don't understand. You are not being specific enough. We don't understand what browser means. Oh my God. So you are part of the world that really deeply understands that. I don't know how communities are formed. I know that when I, you know, sometimes I'm asked to do like master classes, you know, at the New School or someplace like that. And on like the business of acting, which is hilarious because I really shouldn't speak to that because I'm not savvy in that way.

But I do even remind all those kids in the room every time I go to a college, like, look around this room. This can be if you want your first artistic community and every one of you in this room can help each other make the thing they want to make. Right. And so maybe on this one, I'll film it for you and you'll act in it. And then maybe on yours, I'll act in it and you'll film it for me. And maybe the girl, you know, two seats down has an uncle who's like a music producer and maybe she'll share your beats with it. Like, like you just never know. So for me, it all happened in a room. But I have friends who have kids who are blowing up in the music business and it's because they've just posted their stuff on YouTube or wherever. So this idea of, I mean, I think you can gain traction in on the Internet with the thing you make, but I don't know that you build community that way.

[21:51] Alan Seales: That's what I was sort of getting at, because you, I think with the Internet, it's more of building a following, which is not the same as community, because community to me is something that is reliable, supportive, intimate, personal, and, you know, like, would you want to share with all of your followers that you like drinking out of a baby bottle when you come home at the end of your...

[22:16] Ilana Levine: I will share that I'm drinking right now. I am drinking a Dunkin Donuts iced coffee and I'm not ashamed to admit it. I know and I know you know this, too, that what has been really incredible to me in the part of my life that is podcasting is. A, I know that I'm stating the obvious, but people all over the globe listen, right? Like when I started this and you started this, I know it's an obvi, but it was not to me that I would start getting DMs from people in Dubai, Iraq, Barcelona and Philly, right? Like really local and really global. And so I also didn't realize how much and how many people have to hide their love or even the fact that they are listening to Broadway musicals because they're only allowed to be listening if they listen to music at all to religious music.

Right? Like we're still living in a world. So what I would say is when we talk about followers or community, as opposed to someone you're making something with, it's been really beautiful to me to see the way that these podcasts, these conversations become a safe space for other people to share with me, with you, with all of us who are a part of the Broadway Podcast Network and other places secrets that they can't share their sexuality. It's so complex. So I don't know how to divide it up into like followers versus real life friends versus collaborators. But I do know that there's been a really beautiful space that's opened up for me to be able to be in communication with people who in some ways feel like they know me because they've listened to hundreds of episodes and feel like I might understand or be compassionate or open to whatever they're going through.

And maybe that's the part of me that went to that first acting class and was not judgmental of what I was watching, but fascinated and empathetic and wondered what happened to this person when she was young, that that's still her comfort. Right? Like as an adult person, I do feel really lucky that I grew up in a time where people called each other on the phone and had really long conversations with each other and met in coffee shops and late-night drinks after shows and sat and talked for hours about the thing we just saw rather than just tweeting about it or posting a picture of the Playbill in front of the set, you know, to promote it. So it's like I get why your question is sort of open-ended in a way, because I've had just the unique, unique fortune in my life to come into contact through job after job or friends of people that I met on a job and have had really long-lasting, deep, deep friendships for years and years now.

And part of that is also I stayed in one place like I've been, you know, I didn't move to another country, you know, I've been here, I'm right here. We've all kind of stayed here. We're in New York. I do believe the center of the world, you know.

[25:49] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[26:09] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[26:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[26:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[26:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[27:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[27:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[27:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[28:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[28:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[28:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[29:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[29:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[29:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[30:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[30:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[30:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[31:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[31:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[31:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[32:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[32:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[32:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[33:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[33:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[33:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[34:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[34:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[34:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[35:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[35:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[35:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[36:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[36:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[36:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[37:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[37:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[37:57] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[38:17] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[38:37] Ilana Levine: I'm your host, Ilana Levine, and welcome back to another episode of The Broadway Podcast.

[39:14] Alan Seales: Welcome back to The Theatre Podcast. Today, I am thrilled to have Ilana Levine with me.

[39:22] Ilana Levine: Thank you for having me, Alan.

[39:23] Alan Seales: You have such an impressive background in theatre and acting. Can you tell us a bit about how you got started?

[39:30] Ilana Levine: Well, I was infected by my mom's love for Broadway shows from a very early age. I remember getting a haircut by one of the most handsome people I had ever seen when I was 18, and that led me to his acting studio in New York. I walked into a room where people were performing a private moment exercise, and it changed everything for me, including my college major.

[39:59] Alan Seales: That sounds like a pivotal moment. How did that experience shape your career?

[40:05] Ilana Levine: It was everything. I realized the importance of being surrounded by talented people and having an artistic community where you can "fail beautifully over and over again." That support is crucial in this industry.

[40:30] Alan Seales: You also ventured into podcasting in 2016. What inspired you to start your own shows?

[40:36] Ilana Levine: My friends always said there was something about me that made it easy for people to open up. I wanted to create a safe space for people to share their stories and discuss complex issues. Podcasting became a great avenue for that.

[41:00] Alan Seales: That's wonderful. You host a couple of shows now, right?

[41:05] Ilana Levine: Yes, I host "Little Known Facts with Ilana Levine," "And the Award Goes To...," and "How To Be More Chill." Each show allows me to connect with people and explore their journeys in the arts.

[41:30] Alan Seales: It sounds like connection is a big motivator for you.

[41:35] Ilana Levine: Absolutely. Creating art with others and connecting with people is what drives me in life.