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[0:00] Mike Abrams: Welcome to The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of Cast Astrophe. I'm your host Mike Abrams, and today we are celebrating Andrew Lloyd Webber.

[0:25] Mike Abrams: With Phantom of the Opera set to close on Broadway, I'm having a handful of what I'm calling the Phantom Cats on the podcast. So, today my guest has been performing in Phantom of the Opera, but before that she was Grizabella on the first European tour of Cats. So, welcome Janet Saia, and thank you for joining me.

[0:41] Janet Saia: Thank you. So good to be here. Thanks for inviting me.

[0:45] Mike Abrams: Yeah, excited to have you. I love talking to Grizabellas, because I love and I'm always worried because my entire podcast and thesis is like, I don't think your character is deserving. But it's always fun. I know, right? But it's always fun because I think you have such a close interpretation and can answer some of the stuff that's unanswered with that. And I also like the fact that this is a production I haven't talked to anybody from yet with the first European tour.

[1:06] Mike Abrams: So, let's start at the beginning. I always ask, my first question is usually to newer cast members or people who are on the current tour. I'm like, what did you think of the 98 movie or when did you first see it? But you predate that. So, before you got cast in the show, how familiar were you with it and did you get a chance to see it ahead of time? Where was that in your theater journey before you end up on that first tour?

[1:44] Janet Saia: Oh, my gosh. It goes all the way back to when I was singing in my bedroom as a teenager. I used to listen to Barbra Streisand and her version of Memory is what was in my head. And so, that was my first introduction to Cats. I used to sing Barbra Streisand's Memory in my bedroom. So, her beautiful rendition of that song was in my head naturally when I went to the audition. The day I went to the audition, I didn't want to go. It was in New York City, of course. And I was dragged there by my buddy after we both got cut from the audition for Fiddler on the Roof. And so, she dragged me to this dance call for Cats, European tour. And I stood in the back. I had the wrong shoes on. I had like Fiddler on the Roof little lace-up boots with a heel and a little peasant dress.

I was in the back row dancing. And I'm a dancer, but I'm predominantly a singer-actress. And I danced and did the best I could. And they called me back right then and there. And they said, do you sing Memory? And I said, well, the Barbra Streisand version. And so, I belted it out and I strangely got the job. So, it was really bizarre how it happened.

[3:04] Mike Abrams: So, you knew the Barbra Streisand version of Memory, but had you had a chance to even see it? Or was that just like a recording you had that you sang as just a great song to belt?

[3:14] Janet Saia: Yeah, a great song to develop that I really connected to and loved to belt. I mean, of course, I think they called me back and had me sing the Weber version. But it wasn't just, you're hired on the spot.

[3:31] Mike Abrams: Totally, totally.

[3:32] Janet Saia: But I was called back and put through the ringer, of course. But yeah, so that was how I got it. And then it started in Langenthal, Switzerland. So, we rehearsed for six weeks, an absolutely incredible cast. We rehearsed and we learned the show in German and English, and it took six weeks.

[3:55] Mike Abrams: That was one of my questions for you. Again, I've talked to some people who've done it in Vienna and who've done it in Hamburg. And learning in German just sounds crazy to me to start with. But you had to go back and forth on tour between English and German, depending on the stop, right?

[4:12] Janet Saia: Yes, and it was a good thing that I came from an opera background. I studied opera for about four years in the very beginning of my training. And so, I had to study German in college. So, I was very familiar with the language, and that helped me quite a bit. So, yeah, we had to switch back and forth. I think we sang it, well, we went to Austria. So, the tour hit all the major cities in Switzerland for one month each, which was absolutely just stunning.

[4:44] Mike Abrams: A month?

[4:45] Janet Saia: A month in each city.

[4:46] Mike Abrams: Wow, that's a long tour stop.

[4:50] Janet Saia: It was Zurich and Basel and Langenthal and Bregenz. Austria, Graz, Austria was absolutely my favorite, all-time favorite stop there. And in between opening nights, I would take three or four days off and go tour Italy and surrounding areas. It was one of the just greatest moments of my career to do that tour as Griz.

[5:16] Mike Abrams: Yeah, what a cool experience, because it's such a beautiful country and cool places to get to go see. I want to go back. So, before you had your six-weeks rehearsal, had you seen the stage version at all? Did you see the Broadway version while you were in New York? Or were you learning it without having seen somebody else perform it?

[5:37] Janet Saia: Yeah, no, I don't actually remember when I saw it. But I do remember when I graduated from college, a good friend of mine whisked me off to the city, and we saw like three shows in two days. And I think that's when I saw Cats. So, I knew, yeah, the Broadway version.

[5:54] Mike Abrams: You had at least seen one version, so you weren't going in cold. You weren't trying to turn your fiddler hat off and try to dance from scratch. You had at least some idea of what's going on.

[6:07] Janet Saia: Yeah, I had a base of knowledge. I saw the Broadway version. In fact, Richard Poole, who I performed with in Phantom, was in that Broadway version. So, that's really funny. I'm looking at my program now, and he's in it, an absolutely incredible performer, Richard Poole. So, yeah, I had knowledge of what I was getting myself into.

[6:27] Mike Abrams: Wow, okay. Yeah, there's a lot of Phantom to Cats crossover, which is why we're here a little bit today. So, we'll get to that part in a little bit. But before that, I want to go back to the rehearsal process. So, I am fascinated by, you're obviously learning the song and the dance in two different languages of doing it. But how much time do they put and spend going on tour into the backstories and the relationships and stuff like that? What do you remember from that part of the rehearsal?

[7:02] Janet Saia: I remember the director working with me individually, of course, you know, coming up and telling me about Grizabella and how she's perceived by the other cats, sneered at, and, you know, they run away from her as she enters the stage because she's downtrodden and she's had a life that is, you know, wild, wild, full of glitz and, you know, ups and downs and the hard life and the crazy life and waking up in all kinds of bars, you know. So, she was a great star and the director would, you know, feed me these things in quietly in my ear as the other cats were doing their rehearsing. And I would go back, you know, especially with that first moment where Grizabella comes out on the stage and she's trying to go through the motions of her dance that she once used to do, but her body's falling apart and she's just a hot mess.

So, yeah, he would, you know, he would try to help me have the relationship with the other cats where I'm like saying, hey, you know, this is what I used to be. Give me a chance. I'm worthy to be picked to go to the Heaviside Lair. I'm the most needy because I've struggled and had such a hard life, you know.

[8:37] Mike Abrams: So, I've heard some really interesting things about the rehearsal process with Grizabella because it's almost like you're pulled out and separated intentionally to kind of create some of that, not animosity, but like that you're shunned early on and then you're accepted later. And so, that is kind of being built in by the way they're doing that. How does that relate on tour when, I guess your tour was, if you were doing a month at a time, you were a little bit more stable, but I've always found it fascinating that it takes almost a deep level of acting because I'm sure you become really close with your castmates as you're traveling around the countries with them and they have to then every night go out and pretend to hate you at first and then embrace you.

So, what is that like to kind of go and, I mean, is it that you put your makeup on and you kind of get into character and mode and that's the acting piece or is it really pretty challenging having these deep relationships with all these people and then have to go and almost have this dark moment before that happens?

[9:41] Janet Saia: Yeah, well, it's kind of built into the structure of the show. I mean, in the very beginning, we're all dancing Jellicats together and I'm not Grizabella. I'm like a younger Grizabella and I'm back in the back row dancing with everyone and then I have a lot of time to myself because I'm not in all those numbers and so I kind of go off and wander the halls and watch them from the sidelines, which is probably what Grizabella, the cat, would do anyway. She's not able to join in the fun, so she's kind of on the sidelines looking in but thinking to herself, well, I once used to be able to do that and I was the best, you know, or something. So I would, you know, hang out backstage and watch the show and then I would get my huge fur coat on and as you put on a costume, you slowly, you know, come into that character and you're putting on that makeup and your mascara is just dripping down your face and your lip is torn and you, yeah, you get into the character and that wig, oh, I had the most fantastic wig, it's just tattered and torn in all different levels and standing up at the ears and, you know, you really do become that forlorn, desperate animal that's ripped and torn and you howl yourself onto stage and you see them all staring at you and you sneer back and, you know, try to let them know that you're worthy and that, you know, you want to be included with them even though you've had a downturn. So, yeah, it was always exciting to me.

[11:21] Janet Saia: But one of the things, one of my best friends that I'm still friends with today was Victoria the White Cat and she was the one that we hung out a lot and toured around and partied and did fun things with so I was always really connected to her in particular and we're still friends today. She lives in Scotland.

[11:42] Mike Abrams: That's awesome. I think there's a lot of question about the Victoria Grizabella relationship and so having like one of your best friends doing that, did you play that as mother, as mother-daughter? Or were you told anything about that relationship?

[11:59] Janet Saia: I can't remember. It was so long ago. I mean, she's the innocent one. She's the fresh one and I'm the wretched old glamour queen. So, the opposite there of this beautiful, pure, innocent being and, you know, the person who's been through it all and has so many stories to tell. I really feel that I have a lot to tell Victoria about being a cat and what to watch out for. And so, in the end, when she is the one who chooses me and touches my outreached hand, that's just such a special and beautiful moment. It's like a magical moment where, you know, I am revealed as the one, the chosen one. But in my opinion, I think that Victoria should go with me up to the Heaviside Lair. That's what I feel like. And maybe I'm ahead of myself here, but that's what I think.

[13:02] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I want to put a pause on that because I got a lot of follow-up questions for that. And that is my final question for you. So, I really like where we're going to go with that. So, we will come back to that.

[13:29] Mike Abrams: But there is a population that believes that Victoria was abandoned by Grizabella and is now mom, and that's why there's a connection coming back. And then there's also a faction that believes that Victoria could become the next Grizabella if she's not careful, and Grizabella is the role model to tell her not to do that. And so there's almost a split between that. And so it's interesting to hear. And then also hearing that you're good friends with the Victoria offstage, like how to play that connection as either the peer. Does that ever drift offstage? Like when you're having the, like, I'm the role model, when you were out living it up in Switzerland, were you like, okay, I made that mistake. You don't go make that mistake when you're out at the bar, or do you just separate life and work?

[14:18] Janet Saia: It probably, I mean, separate life and work, you know, I mean, I wasn't I wasn't a mom at the time. When I did Grizabella, I'm a mom now. But yeah, I would let people just do whatever they want and be wild and have fun. And yeah, I pretty much I mean, when I was on tour, though, my sister Sherry came out, and she was pretty wild. So I did have to rein her in a bit. Yeah, we ran and did some pretty fun things.

[14:53] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I love it. The end Grizabella, not the beginning Grizabella is what you're bringing in. I want to go back to a piece on the performance that you said, you know, you kind of stand off to the side. Grizabella has, at least from what I've been told, about 15 minutes on stage. And so as a performer, in a show that has, you know, most of the other cats are on almost the entire time. How is it? Like, how do you prepare to get across such a powerful moment, a powerful piece in a short window of time? Like, how do you prep for that every night to know that like, I've got this extreme, you know, I got a bell, I've got this great number, I've got to really tell a huge part of the story in a shorter window?

[15:36] Janet Saia: Mm hmm. Yeah, it requires a lot of prep before you head out there. I mean, I'm a very physical person. Like I said, I'm a dancer, I was a dancer. And so getting into the physicality of it. You know, making sure your costume's on in time and doing some of the motion of the cat before you get on stage. Like connecting to your body is really important so that you come on already fully in character and fully in the memory in the backstory of what, you know, you've gone through in life, how you've been abused and, or remembering your great moments when you were a star and just kind of living in the world of your memories. I mean, that's what the song is about, let the memory live again. And so you're, she's wrapped up in her memories of how great she was, and she thinks she can go out there and do it again.

By reliving that memory, and telling others to live the memory, then that's how you find happiness. So, Grizabella trying to find happiness by reliving her memory. That's kind of how I would get into the character there.

[16:46] Mike Abrams: Okay. Yeah.

[16:47] Janet Saia: Yeah. So that's interesting that you're kind of off stage kind of trying to almost mimic the motions that way when you walk on, you're fully ready to go.

[16:54] Janet Saia: Oh, yeah. Yeah. And actors also are good at just switching it on. You can just, when you've trained and trained and spent your life doing it, you just, you know, you're standing there as Janet, and then next thing you know, boom, you just, you just, you only have to say one sentence or put your mind back into one image or memory, and then you're in it, you know?

[17:18] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[17:18] Janet Saia: Yeah. As someone, again, not at all in the world, it's your profession and a skill and something that you all have trained for, for your entire life to be able to do that. And then I do think in Cats too, you put on the leotard and the makeup and the jacket, so it's even almost a little bit more like you're really in character by the time you kind of go out there. Different than maybe Fiddler, you know, or some of the other things where you're slightly in costume, but not nearly as like, you really have to get in costume in Cats.

[17:48] Janet Saia: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm looking at, I have a painting of the makeup that I had to put on every night. That was a big part of the job, definitely. You know, getting your face all duded up.

[18:02] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[18:02] Janet Saia: Yeah.

[18:03] Mike Abrams: I want to talk a little bit about other character relationships. Did you think, like, Victoria's like a very big one. There's also some potential theories about Bombalurina and Demeter. There's also, you know, with any of the maybe the older male cats of like the past relationships, or if you're in Macavity's crime gang, like, what were the things that you thought about when you were kind of going on tour to help kind of create that arc of the memories that you're reliving? Like, did you think about the Jellicle family when you kind of had that?

[18:34] Janet Saia: Yeah. I mean, you know, it's like a big reunion when we all come together on stage. And so, I don't know, you know, maybe I haven't seen these cats in a long time. And there's some memories from Rum Tum Tugger that maybe I want to relive or not relive. So he's such a wild, fun cat. I'm sure there was some something going on with them. I don't know. I don't remember exactly the relationships like, between those cats, Bustopher Jones and Growl Tiger. I mean, yeah, I think that maybe the kittens, I don't know, could have been kittens that I birthed, for sure. You know, Bombalurina, I was friends with her too, at Joni McDonald. She was incredible. And I don't remember the relationship I had with her in terms of, you know, our onstage characters.

[19:34] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I realize I'm asking you to go back 20 years of memory of a backstory that's not spoken on stage to be like, yeah, this is exactly how I did it. I can tell you a couple that I think are, not maybe necessarily the like, 100%, but definitely ones that are thought about a lot. So I think one is obviously the Victoria, which we'll get to, because I know that I like, I love where you're going of bringing her with you. But there was the potentially being Bomb's mother, or like you were her role model growing up and like aunt or something. And that was almost the fear of that she could also go down that path if she's not careful, because of her relationship with Macavity.

[20:15] Janet Saia: Yeah, yeah. I mean, I definitely am like, the grandmother, like telling people, look at me, even though I've gone the wrong path, still, I hold my dignity together, you know, so I keep myself from falling apart. So I'm kind of saying to them, yeah, you know, be careful, watch out, because this is what you'll turn into. But still, I'm holding myself together. And I mean, the kittens, you know, have to be nice to them. And I see Cassandra. Cassandra is the Siamese cat. And I mean, she's so gorgeous. But someday still, she could be like me. So I have to show her it's not all youth and glamour and attitude. You know, she could be doomed too.

[21:09] Mike Abrams: Did you ever think about where Grizabella went when she left? Like, you know, the story arc, if she left, and you know, we're getting the very end of that she's coming back to be reunited with the family and accepted by the family. Where did where does she go? Like, is she part of Macavity's crime gang? Does she leave the Jellicles for drugs and sex and all kinds of stuff? Like, what what is? Did you even think about that? Or was it more of like, you just kind of came back to this is where I'm returning?

[21:42] Janet Saia: Yeah, um, you know, she probably went back to her cave somewhere. And I don't know, I don't know where you know, I don't know where she would have hid out. But she's been in so many bars and places all over, you know, the town that she probably just hung out in her regular, you know, haunt.

[22:04] Mike Abrams: Okay. I love it. That's such a much more wholesome version than what I what I think like I have written for Grizabella on her way out. You know, I feel like she's, I picture the, like, you know, a very wild, go off and do all kinds of crazy stuff, sex, drugs, all the stuff in between and going everywhere to where you're on like the most insane bender almost like hangover style bender. And then it's now like, okay, time, time, like time to get back here. And yeah, my redemption arc, digging herself out of a black hole that she's been in for so many years, I'm sure or something like that, or, hey, maybe just wild and crazy fun. But then once it takes a toll on her little body, she's like, Oh, God, how am I going to get out of this? And come back to the fam or the group or the tribe?

[23:06] Janet Saia: Yeah, and it's like the superstar that kind of falls off the deep end for a little bit, you know, makes it makes the break is the the star from the family that got out. Yeah, made it too big. And then it's coming back. And now she wants to come back. And she's trying to get her last, you know, moment. And she gets it. So yeah, she does. She does. Were there any other, like any other things that you remember from the tour? Or the like, especially the backstories? We were just like, Oh, we definitely thought about this. But that's not really set on stage. Like, was there any unique moments to your, your tour that you as like, again, this is a tour that's not as documented, because it's, you know, pre predates most of the internet age type of, you know, where now everything is word for word documented and on social media and everything. But like, what were some of the parts that you remember from your from your group? And from that, that tour that was like, unique to your tour?

[24:01] Janet Saia: Um, I mean, let me think. MonkaStrap. MonkaStrap. I remember MonkaStrap just being really strong. He's like the narrator for the piece. And I remember him being like, in charge of everybody. And but he would bar me from entering the stage. And I would just tell him, I had the authority over him more to get to push him away and say, No, you're not going to block me. I'm, I'm the great Grizabella. So I remember some of the relationships with him. And it's so hard to remember all the way back.

[24:37] Mike Abrams: No big deal. Okay. Yeah, no, I think it's, it's part of the like, the fun of doing this is it's been on for so long and been running for so long that there's, there's just like endless stories from this and, and versions and interpretations and everything else. I want to hear a little bit like, I think you mentioned, but I want to hear where were your favorite tour stops? Like, you know, in the European tour, as someone, you know, not from there and going over with where were your favorite places to, to stop during that tour?

[25:11] Janet Saia: Um, I would say Geneva, Geneva was incredible. People would lay out on the piers in the sun in the summer, we were there in the summer. So people would just lay out on the piers, like in the city, it wasn't even a beach or anything, they just have a pier that went out into the lake, and grass, and everybody was just out there as if it was a beach. And even some people were topless. And that was one of the things that I was like, whoa, right here in the city. That was pretty wild. I loved, what I love most about Switzerland was just walking along these beautiful river walks. And of course, in Langenthal, just the mountains, and you know, I'd go off to the Zermatt, the city of Zermatt, where they have the Matterhorn Mountain, which is like, if you go to Disney, they've got the Matterhorn, that mountain, I couldn't ski because I was in a show, but I just, oh, that was so incredible to be on the top of the Matterhorn.

[26:09] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I can't imagine, Grizabella, having a ski injury here, and you can't perform the next day. But yeah, I've been there, it's one of the most beautiful towns I've ever seen.

[26:17] Janet Saia: Oh, yeah. And then I have a really, really, really special memory from Graz, Austria, because my father, who I adore, he's the reason I'm on stage today, he decided to come out and see me in Graz, Austria. And I said, Okay, get yourself out there. I'll be rehearsing at the Graz Opera House. So wait till I'm done with my rehearsal, and then I'll see you at the hotel. And so I'm in there rehearsing, I'm singing Memory. And I look up, and who is in the balcony seat, all the way from San Francisco, California. But my father is sitting up there in the balcony, right in the middle of me singing Memory in rehearsal. So that was like, just how did he

[26:58] Mike Abrams: But they couldn't be more different. So I would love to hear a little bit about not necessarily transition, but you've done both. Tell me a little bit about your current getting into Phantom and kind of being part of it, and then how you kind of have the similarities and differences between these two Andrew Lloyd Webber shows.

[27:48] Janet Saia: Well, I got into Phantom, strangely, from a Cats audition. I was back in New York, and I went to a Cats audition as a dancer. And I got cut because I did the wrong hands or something. I did Phantom hands where I'm supposed to be doing Cats hands. And as I walked out the door, in walked Kristen Blodgett. And she said, Janet, what are you doing at the dance call? You're a singer. I said, oh, yeah, well, I love to dance. And so she said, well, stay because you can sing. So she hired me to play yet another cat, Jenny Any Dots, in the Westchester Dinner Theater version of Cats that she was working on. And I did that. And while we were working in that, she called me to the side one day and said, come in this studio here.

I want to hear you sing. And we worked together just on some other music. And then a day later, she called and said, hey, do you have a high E? I said, well, I've been belting out Cats. But yeah, give me a couple days and I'll build a high E. She said, well, we need a swing at Phantom on Broadway. I said, oh, great. Okay. So I worked up my high operatic E. And she called me in and put on a diva suit and sang Carlotta notes. And I got hired to be the swing. That was my first Broadway job. And boy, did I work hard for that. It took me a long time to get on Broadway, but it was just so exciting when I finally got that contract and walked to the Majestic Theater, which I absolutely adore, for the very first time after wandering around Times Square in my 20s, you know, just saying, when is it going to be my turn?

When? I know I'm going to work in one of these theaters one day. But to finally get my own theater, the Majestic, which strangely, I had been in to see my first Broadway show, which is 42nd Street, when I was a teenager. So yeah, it's kind of interesting, right? Yeah, I came full circle, full circle, 42nd Street in the house. And now I'm on the stage at the Majestic.

[30:01] Mike Abrams: Let me just quickly talk that you just like casually threw in that you did a Jenny Any Dots dinner theater production.

[30:05] Janet Saia: Yes, yes, I remember slipping on potato skins as I was tap dancing as Jenny Any Dots. Yeah, no. Yeah, so that was after the tour. After the tour, right, after the tour. And actually, it was after I did the tour of Phantom 2. So after the Phantom tour, that's when I auditioned for the Cats at Westchester. And yeah, yep, Cats Westchester. So fun. Okay, so you did Cats Westchester, Jenny Any Dots, tap number. Tap number with all the little mice and the big huge fat suit, and then rip it off and put on your fringe tap dance suit. That was fun, too. But it was in the middle of that when Kristen took me out and put me in Phantom Broadway. So boy, am I grateful for that Jenny Any Dots chance.

[31:07] Janet Saia: Yeah, yeah. I mean, again, it's such an interesting parallel of, again, a lot of the same people working because it's two of his shows. Yeah, and so I've heard the reverse, too, that someone ended up in Cats because of a Phantom, and there's a lot of that back and forth.

[31:21] Janet Saia: Yeah, well, I'm an Andrew Lloyd Webber girl. I mean, Evita is the reason why I switched from opera training. I was going to be an opera singer and I switched to musical theater when I was at San Francisco State University because I saw Evita and I said, that's what I want to do. I can do that. And I was in Evita in college, but never the Broadway version. So yeah, I've actually been associated with Andrew Lloyd Webber in three of his shows.

[31:47] Mike Abrams: Wow. Yeah. Well, let's go to some rapid fire because I want to get to the most important question here, and I've got a lot of follow-ups now because you've already teased your answer. But let's start with, if you could go on as any cat, ignoring male, female, singer, dancer, whatever, who would you want to play for just one night? Which track?

[32:12] Janet Saia: Oh my gosh. It would definitely be Bambi. I always, when I was in the show, I used to look at Bambi and be like, oh, she's swinging. Yeah, I would definitely want to be that fierce girl. And I love to watch Joni MacDonald in our company do it and just be like, oh man, I should really be playing that part. I love it. Yeah, she's awesome.

[32:41] Mike Abrams: Who are your favorite and least favorite cats?

[32:45] Janet Saia: You know, I really didn't like the number Peaks and Pollicles. That was my least favorite cat, sorry to say. And my favorite cat, aside from Griz, of course, is probably Mistoffelees, because I was just thrilled, thrilled at that dance number and watching him do those Cheney turns. I think that's what they're called. Yeah, the, no, not Cheney. Yeah, the turns that he does at the end there, like 20 or 30 of those jeté turns or whatever. No, not jeté turns. I can't remember the ballet term, but that was just magical. And the guy we had was amazing. So yeah, yeah, that was...

[33:33] Mike Abrams: What is your favorite song from the show?

[33:36] Janet Saia: Macavity and Memory, of course. I love Macavity. Macavity is just so much fun.

[33:43] Mike Abrams: Yeah, and it goes back to your Bambi kind of piece. I love my, here's my phantom crossover. If you had, if one cat was going to haunt a theater, who do you think would be best at it?

[33:55] Janet Saia: If one cat was going to haunt the Winter Garden?

[33:58] Mike Abrams: If he was going to be the, any theater, yeah. If he's going to come back and be like the, you know, the phantom of the opera kind of haunting, which cat do you think would be able to be the best one to do that?

[34:09] Janet Saia: Ooh, which cat would haunt the theater? Well, probably Growltiger, because he was such, he was such a, um, a theater, like old time lover of the theater. Like he was built into the, you know, he just, it's like he was born in the theater. He was meant to be.

[34:37] Mike Abrams: Yeah, that's a really good answer. I hadn't thought about him because I, most of my knowledge is from the more recent production where he's not in it. Um, I mean, I'm talking about Gus, Gus, yeah, Gus, Gus Growltiger.

[34:51] Janet Saia: Yeah.

[34:51] Mike Abrams: Yeah. But yeah, but the Growltiger, but to that, like that little insert of the performance is very, yeah, that's a great answer. I hadn't thought that. I love it.

[35:03] Janet Saia: Yeah. Really. I guess I'm saying that because the, the Gus that I perform with, um, in Europe, he gave me his amazing robe. We all wear robes backstage. And when I left the show a little bit early, I left after one year, um, he gave me his robe and I took that robe and I wore it at Phantom for my first year there, which is, which is interesting. So I already feel like Gus is haunting the Majestic Theater because his robe is there. We've got a lot of extra robes laying around the theater. Whenever I see his robe, I think, Oh, Gus is here.

[35:40] Mike Abrams: I love that. Um, okay. So million dollar question and you kind of tease your answer a little bit, but I have argued that I actually don't think Grizabella should be the Jellicle choice. Um, so I want you to either defend Grizabella or give a different theory. I love, I love to hear the theory of that Victoria's coming with you, or do you think a different cat should be picked or what is your interpretation of this?

[36:04] Janet Saia: Well, we're all going out and telling our stories and, and, you know, saying why we, we need to be, um, chosen to go beyond, but I, I, I will stick with Grizabella and I will stick with that because she's saying, touch me. It's so easy to leave me in these dark times. Um, if you touch me, you will understand what happiness is. So she's inviting all of them to know happiness. And, um, I love that about her. And so as she reaches her little hand back, asking for someone to choose her and they do, I just feel like she's saying, choose me and we'll all be happy, you know? And, and so Victoria is the one that, that dips her little paw into mine and, um, and chooses me to go up. So I think that, you know, just like in ancient times when somebody would be buried and they would bury their cat with them in the tomb to go with them up to the Heaviside Layer to heaven or wherever beyond they would go.

I think that Victoria should go with Griz as her companion in the afterlife. And the two of them should ascend, you know, whether you think it's mother and daughter or, or, uh, any other, um, downtrodden and innocent, they both should go up together.

[37:26] Mike Abrams: And I love the thought there that you've got to, like, they're going to go together. You're going to have like, it's a companion to go with you. It's in that, like, I've always kind of thought it a little bit is about being reborn and that, you know, like Grizabella is going to go up and then potentially come right back as kind of like a new reborn, fresh life. So I like that. It's like, all right, we're both going to go together and we're both going to start fresh together.

[37:53] Janet Saia: Right. Right.

[37:54] Mike Abrams: Is this, is this part of this, does this go back to the fact that you and the Victoria were really good friends and it's like, all right, we're going to celebrate together. We're going to go up there together and then come back together because we've been going out to every night together.

[38:06] Janet Saia: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we have been friends all these years, so she, she did move on from the show with me. So maybe that does have something to do with it that, hey, I left the show, but I took a friend along the future journey with me. Yeah.

[38:24] Mike Abrams: I love it. I do think so much of the interpretations stem from, like, the actor relationships, like the outside of the theater relationships. And so it's, it's cool to hear a different one like that because it's something I hadn't like, you know, if I take two people out of it, I hadn't thought about Victoria ever going up with, with Grizabella or, you know, the two cats I had always joked go together would be, you know, Tugger and Mistoffelees together or like some, you know, some version of a different pairing. But yeah, that's a fun, it's a fun answer.

[39:05] Janet Saia: Yeah. Or Demeter and Bombie, would they go together? And definitely Gus and Jelly Lorem, they would definitely go together.

[39:09] Mike Abrams: Yeah. There's a lot of versions of that now. So now I've thought of like, okay, now there's a lot of ways of how do we, like, this is changing the, the Jellicle choice every year to not just one cat. We're going to pick two every year now.

[39:16] Janet Saia: Two cats, right. We'll have to contact Trevor Nunn and have him. He's good at changing things up and solving problems that other people wouldn't think of.

[39:27] Mike Abrams: I love it. I love it. Well, this has been super fun. How can people stay in touch? This is going to come out, you know, like right around the end of the Phantom closing. So how can people stay in touch with you?

[39:41] Janet Saia: On my website, JanetSaia.com.

[39:43] Mike Abrams: Awesome.

[39:44] Mike Abrams: Website, we'll, we'll link it and so people can, can stay in touch and all the, everything you're working on.

[39:49] Janet Saia: Great. It's been so fun.

[39:52] Mike Abrams: Thank you so much for coming on. Yeah. It was nice to have you and hear all the stories. It's been great thinking back on all the memories. My pleasure.

[40:00] Mike Abrams: Awesome. And thanks everyone else for listening to this episode of The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of the Cats atrophy. To follow along, you can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or anywhere else to listen to podcasts. Follow us on Twitter, Instagram, and TikTok at TheWrongCatDied or check out our website, TheWrongCatDied.com.