This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:01] Mike Abrams: There's a cat over here. There's a cat over there. And the wrong one died. And the wrong one died.

[0:18] Mike Abrams: Welcome to The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown that casts at your feet. I'm your host, Mike Abrams, and today we have another meet. You'll be seeing her in Andrew Lloyd Webber's new Broadway show, Bad Cinderella. But before that, she was Demeter in the 2016 Broadway revival of Cats. So welcome, Robin Masella. Thank you for joining me.

[0:34] Robin Masella: I'm so excited to be here.

[0:37] Mike Abrams: I always enjoy talking to Demeter because I find Demeter's character fascinating in itself just because it's a very dark story. And it's like this, you know, it's just like the one universal truth is her background. And that to me is fascinating in itself. So we'll get there. But before we talk to Demeter, I want to hear your cat's history. So walk me through, when was the first time you saw it? When was the first introduction to it? You know, how familiar were you with it before 2016?

[1:07] Robin Masella: Yeah. So I saw Cats for the first time in London, actually, when I was about seven or eight years old. And I was a dancer, took dance class since I was two years old, waving a ribbon around the room. And I just fell in love with it. And I can't remember if I at that point was familiar with the music and the show, but that was the first time I'd seen it. And I remember that the cats came down into the audience and I happened to be sitting on the aisle. And I remember exactly what shirt I was wearing. And one of the cats came up to me and kind of nuzzled their nose up against me. And I remember her makeup left like a little pink stain on the shoulder. And I just, I kept that shirt forever. And I thought, oh, my gosh, the cat came up to me.

And I just, I felt like I was, you know, touched by that particular cat. And then I was one of those little girls that danced around the living room to, I'm dating myself here, the record of Cats. And my mom would always yell at me not to jump because it would make the record skip. And, yeah, I just fell in love with it at such an early age. And because I grew up dancing, just loved it. And then, of course, was familiar with the VHS and watched that to no end. And then years and years later, found myself in this profession and auditioned for the revival. But, yeah, the revival was the first time that I was ever in it.

[2:44] Mike Abrams: I love that. So what's fascinating about that is I it's green eyes, which is what you're talking about when they're in the crowd. Is such a polarizing piece for me because I was not on the aisle and I was not thrilled and looking forward to having them jump out and scare me. I was not prepared for it. They don't do it anymore, obviously, with COVID reasons. Now, did you have what was your experience like doing green eyes? You know, did you have more people that were like you that were excited to have them? You kind of dazzle up to them or did you have more people like I think somebody in your cast got punched at least once?

[3:16] Robin Masella: Oh, gosh, I don't think I heard about a child. Hey, I loved it. I love breaking that fourth wall in a show. And it's always interesting because, you know, you're in the moment and you're acting. And there's a moment during the naming of cats where all the cats would come into the audience. That's where we would really be able to see their faces and then be able to see our faces. And we're singing the whole time. So it's just amazing going through this process of your acting and your singing. We're also very aware of how they're reacting. And some people loved it and are giggling. And some people you could see just kind of sit back in their seat and don't want you to come any further. Yeah, it was just so interesting to see different people's reactions. I don't ever think I saw a child cry, but I'm sure it happened because, you know, it's scary.

[4:02] Mike Abrams: Did you lean in more when you saw somebody kind of leaning back? Was that like, oh, yeah, I'm not enjoying this. Yeah, I'm going to get no. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. You know, they're coming to the show. They don't know what to expect, but it's part of it. So it gives you that much more reason to just lean into it, though.

[4:20] Robin Masella: Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Absolutely.

[4:23] Mike Abrams: Yeah, that was what threw me off as I was not I didn't know what I was walking into to begin with. And I had gotten the tickets from a friend for press and for not like I didn't pay for them. And I was as Matt and I had lived in the city very long. And I walked in and, you know, it's a really what I loved is that my friend works in set design. It's an overwhelming and amazing set design. So I was like fascinated by this and also the lights go down and I'm thinking, oh, cool, like facing stage. What am I going to see? And then all of a sudden there's one over my shoulder, you know, from behind. What is happening? I was just not prepared for that. And as someone who does not like to be part of the show, I like to be a spectator. It was it was not my favorite part of the show, but it is now a fun one to think about. I wish they could do it again.

[5:06] Robin Masella: Yeah. Yeah. I think it was cool, too, because in the revival too we the mezzanine level was also accessible. So most of the time that kind of stuff happens in the orchestra because you can come from the back of the house and you have the aisles. But I think that extra shock value of, oh, gosh, now they're up in the mezzanine and roaming all about up there as well was it was a shock value.

[5:30] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So the fun part about that is the second time I saw it, I was sitting in the mezzanine and I made a point to be like, we're not sitting on the aisle. Like, I'm not sitting on the aisle. And we were in the last row of that. And I'm like, oh, great. We're safe. And I'm like back against the wall. And then sure enough, somebody I don't know, I wish I knew who it was, like jumped over and was like above my head. And I'm like, of course, it's a seat to be out of the way. And here I am just completely shocked by a cat.

[5:57] Robin Masella: Yeah. Yeah. That's a fun part.

[6:00] Mike Abrams: So let's talk about the Demeter and the backstory and what you're told. I do like in 2016, you're doing new choreography, you're doing some new takes on the show. But it's still like a lot of the one of the main people are still involved and you're getting kind of a lot of the history still brought to you. So do you remember your three words? And like, I'd love to hear what was the what were you told to formulate your Demeter?

[6:25] Robin Masella: Oh, gosh. My situation was slightly different because I was coming in as an injury replacement. So I didn't get as much of the backstory and the extra time that everyone took in the original cast to, you know, ruminate about the character and all of that. I definitely had some of that. But because I was an injury replacement, it was, you know, how fast can you learn the show and get in as soon as possible? But there were definitely a few words and things that were to me, you know, to me, it was very skittish. She has a history with Macavity and not a happy one, although something deep inside her kind of likes it. And so and she's intense and has this intense bond with. I always think of her sister Bombalurina.

So definitely a lot of the feline movement is influenced by that. I always had neck issues because we're always as her, you know, it's kind of this like back hair on the back of the spine always. Yeah, I'm trying to think of what else she's sensual and sexual and wants to break free and be as free as she can, but is sheltered and afraid at times, which I think was the most fun playing that character because there were so many different levels of ways of being, you know, free and open and sexy, but then also scared and a little bit more timid and shy.

[8:06] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I want to go back to like. So one thing you said that I think is maybe I don't know if I'd say is dramatically different, but it is a little different from what I've heard. So the one thing that always fascinates me about Cats is I've recorded hundreds of over 100 episodes now is that a universal truth is that Demeter was sexually abused by Macavity. And that's like one fact that there's like there's no disputing that you can have arguments about a lot of other of the headcanons. But Demeter was abused. And that one is confirmed. Yeah. But I had always heard that there is a version of like Demeter and Bombalurina are sisters or best friends or whatever. I like that you said sisters. But it was that Demeter was had the similar relationship and Bombalurina had a similar but didn't but liked it.

And so Demeter didn't like it and was abused. She was like the interviews. But you're kind of saying deep down inside that maybe there was a part of you that didn't not the abuse, but like that you the relationship with Macavity was maybe more positive than like you kind of liked it in some capacity.

[9:02] Robin Masella: I'm sure every actor takes it a different way. But at the end of the day, when you're singing Macavity, it's a sexy, sensual song. And to play it negatively the entire time is impossible. So there is, you know, while she's constantly scared that he's there, whether it's that maybe there was just some, you know, messed up thing in her mind that that draws her to Macavity, while also knowing that he was horrible to her and bad for her, you know, not dissimilar from Phantom of the Opera, another Andrew Lloyd Webber show, where, you know, you have this character who Christine is afraid of, but also drawn to in ways. And I think, I don't know, that's what always made it interesting for me, because, yes, she was sexually abused by him or she was attacked by him and she's scared of him. But there's also something deep down that she's drawn to. So that's how I always thought of it.

[10:07] Mike Abrams: Yeah, I appreciate the part about the song, because I the song is one that, like, as I listened to the album more and I got to know, like, when I first saw it, it was Mungojerrie and Rumpelteazer. And that was it. That's all I remember. And obviously memory. But I was like, that's all stuck in my head. And then as I watched it more, I'm like, Macavity's song is like, really, really catchy and really it's very charged and like sexual. Yeah. I hadn't thought about that, that like, even though there is that scared moment, you can't perform that number without having some of that energy. Of course. Part of it. Yeah, of course. Absolutely. And for me personally, it was the most fun of the numbers to do.

[10:48] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So you were in that you were Demeter cover injury replacement and then you also swing. And I think you went on as Demeter, Cassandra and Bombalurina. Yes. And then I sang in the pit every night.

[11:03] Robin Masella: OK. Yeah. Which is a whole nother fascinating piece of Cats that it's such an intense and difficult show to sing and dance that you need a pit and people singing is crazy to me in itself. So my question to you is being able to kind of go on as Demeter and Bombalurina. How was that transitioning to doing the same number side by side, different parts, and then also kind of having the different energy of having the skittish versus like the very confident and want to own the relationship? Like, what was that like going back and forth between those two characters?

[11:33] Robin Masella: Oh, it was so fun. It's always fun when as a performer, we get to do multiple things and play with it. You know, Bombalurina knows who she is and is confident and confident in her sexuality. And like I said, Demeter is a little more timid and skittish, but it was so fun. It gets a little confusing because, you know, you're from a performing point of view, you're like switching lines constantly. And it was definitely a show or two where I was supposed to sing as one character in that split second, thought it was the other and forgot to jump in. But in terms of playing both of those sides, yeah, I guess it really, for me, it was always this, that central sexual side that Demeter had just times a hundred.

[12:27] Mike Abrams: What other relationships when you were Demeter did you play into? Like, there's the obvious Macavity and there's the obvious Bombalurina, but what other different relationships did you have to play off of? And what other like theories did you come up with with the different characters to kind of tell the backstory of your relationship with them?

[12:46] Robin Masella: Yeah. Monkey Strap was always somewhat of a protector for Demeter. Both storyline and just there were a lot of moments that we had together on the stage that felt somewhat like he was an older, like a big brother protecting. Definitely Bombalurina. I always in my brain kind of took the white cat as a friend, but like a strained relationship friend. You know, you start to make up stories in your head, whether you're told them or not, depending on how the show goes and what the choreography is like and who you interact with. And, you know, you start to make up kind of connections as an actor. And so for me, that's what I want to hear. Tell the stories. That wasn't necessarily, you know, I never I never got like crazy far deep into it, but I always felt like the white cat and Demeter had this friendship that was somewhat strained because we didn't spend a lot of time with each other.

But I always felt like there was this connection. So I always felt like I was looking out for her when she wasn't looking and maybe she was looking out for me when I wasn't looking. That's something that I made up. I'm trying to think who else. I always thought Tugger and Demeter had had a thing. I always kind of thought he was her first after the bad stuff happened with Macavity that she kind of took ownership in a sexual, sensual way with him.

[14:17] Robin Masella: He slept with everybody.

[14:22] Mike Abrams: Yeah, those are kind of the big ones. I'm trying to think if there are any others.

[14:25] Mike Abrams: I want to go back to a couple of them. So because I think this is this to me is what's fun. So I like I will start with the white cat because I do think that's one where I don't there's not a lot of at least to my memory documented relationship between you and Victoria. So I do think it's kind of cool to have like we got each other's back version. Did you look at it or feel maybe like as a protector of I don't want you as kind of the new pure cat to go down my path and have that Macavity relationship or was it much more of like a we're both looking out for each other?

[14:45] Robin Masella: I think probably both. I think I always kind of thought though they've had a friendship and she knows what happened to Demeter and I'm sure there was an element of protection because she's, you know, a kitten and very open in terms of her kittenness. And I do think there was probably a part that I thought, yeah, Demeter has to kind of protect her. But I always I don't know why, but I always kept had this thing of like we were close once, but we're not anymore kind of strained relationship. So it was always from afar, as opposed to where Bomb and Demeter were clearly, you know, hanging out every day and going around the same parts of the junkyard. I always made it up that Victoria and Demeter had this kind of strained relationship, but Demeter was still kind of looking out for her from afar.

[15:54] Mike Abrams: OK, I like that. I'd never really thought about the two. Those are two relationships I don't think I've thought about like at all. Yeah. So it's kind of interesting to hear. What about I want to go back to Marcus because I know there is some thought that Demeter and Marcus are actually together. And then I heard he's a big brother. So is it was it more of a brother sister relationship or was it much more of a I mean, I know you talked about Tugger being the first relationship post, but was Marcus trapped like want to be with Demeter partnership, but isn't his friend zone big brother type of thing?

[16:13] Robin Masella: For me, it was always. Yeah, for me, it was always a big brother type of thing. Maybe that's because I was friends with good friends with the actor that played it. And I always kind of thought of him as more of a brotherly relationship than a sexual relationship. I'm sure for people who really got to know even Julie, the original choreographer's idea of the back story, I'm sure maybe there were moments where Monk and Demeter were together. But for me, it always felt like a protective big brother kind of thing. There were a lot of moments in the show where he would, you know, choreographically wise, like do something that to me just felt much more protector brotherly. He knows the back story. He knows what happened. He's always kind of the one when, you know, we're scared that Macavity is there. That's being the person on guard in my mind to protect the people that have negatively been affected by Macavity.

[17:28] Robin Masella: I, the thing that I, this is where this always gets so very strange for me because there is no cast family tree and I've tried to put it together and there is no definitive answer. I've asked, I've asked people that know and there is no definitive, definitive answer. But hearing you say that Monk is brother, and then hearing you say that Tugger is love interest, but then it's pretty clear and Macavity was love interest. But I think it's like pretty universally accepted that Monk, Macavity and Tugger are three brothers and sons of old dude around me. So that gets very strange when you start looking at it. And I'm sure that's why they're just cats and not people.

[18:04] Mike Abrams: Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. It's one of those shows where like, depending on who you talk to and which iteration, some people, I know a lot of people that did the original show in some version had a plethora of backstory and it was very definitive. And I think for the revival, although I, like I said, I wasn't there from day one when they were in rehearsals, it was a little bit looser, I think for the cast to kind of make their own backstories. Um, cause at the end of the day, they're cats singing about cat things.

[18:44] Robin Masella: Yeah. You know, and I think the backstory was more for, for the actor to, um, you know, we always joke, like people say cats is about nothing unless you're a part of the cast and you know, the backstory that was told to you by the previous people before, you know, it's kind of like this, which is why you're doing this podcast. It's kind of this secret relationship, but it's like telephone, like through the years it changes for reasons, you know, for new people joining or different iterations of the show being done. And yeah. Uh, it's, it's so it's, that's so spot on because I, I've been joking, you know, when I started this, it was a, it was a joke, but then all of a sudden now I feel like I'm documenting history of like all the various productions.

[19:28] Mike Abrams: And I asked the same type of questions, everybody, because I get so many vastly different answers and it is a game of telephone and there is not a consistent, I've talked to people who have produced it. I've talked to people who have been in various productions. I've talked to people who like remember everything about it. And people who remember very little about those things. I talked to somebody recently on a Royal Caribbean cruise who got a single paragraph that was like eight sentences and that was it. And it's because, you know, it's not spoken. It's not, there's not the, the dialogue that's there to kind of answer those questions. So it's the emotion and feeling and the part that you need as an actor. And if it's not given to you, you need to create to be able to do this.

[20:07] Robin Masella: Exactly. So many, you know, eight times a week. And so it's, what's made this really fun. And so it's fun too, because when you start looking at the absurdity of those backstories, it is crazy to start putting those together. Cause it's just a very, like the Jellicles are, are not, it's not normal. It's cats, you know, it's not a normal world. And it's really funny to think about that, which is why I'm still here doing this.

[20:32] Mike Abrams: Exactly. Yep. What about relationship with Grizabella? Cause I think that's the other one that's like, she comes back. I have always wondered, was Grizabella potentially a mom that abandoned any of these kittens and cats? And it's like, is it, is that a scenario you ever thought of or played? I know I didn't think of as much. It's definitely a theory for me for Victoria. I hadn't thought about as much for Bomb and Demeter of whether it's like, this is their friend that went off or this was potentially their mom, their mom that abandoned them.

[20:59] Robin Masella: Yeah, I, it's interesting as Demeter, you have this really, I always felt like Demeter had this relationship with Griz where she had this really strong hate and rage for her and didn't exactly know why, but then also was one of the few that felt bad and in some ways understood her. So I never really put a label on it, whether she was a mother that had abandoned or, um, I always also somewhere in my mind kind of felt like Griz, there was like Grizabella and the Macavity connection that interested, but also spooked Demeter given what she went through. Um, they said I never got super specific with that, but I definitely know that there was an intense dislike, but then on the flip side, also this slight weird understanding and pity and for her.

[21:59] Mike Abrams: Yeah. It's almost like Demeter as a whole, like she's, she's like one eight, she's flip-flopping one 80, you know, she's right down the middle, like scared and shy, but also very sexual and hates that character or cat, but also it feels bad for them. You know, it's, I feel like she's just a, not bipolar, but just a little all over the place with her emotions. It's like one extreme or the other.

[22:22] Robin Masella: Yeah. There's a little bit of Demeter potentially following Griz's footsteps. Like, because if you do take the Macavity, I I've always thought that when Griz left, she went to be part of Macavity's crime game. Like she was, he, he brought her out. He ruined the family and relationship. She did a bunch of terrible things for him away from the group. And then now she's coming back for her forgiveness. And I think that there's some potential that Demeter could take that same path if she's not careful. And that's what she has at least a Bomb Ball arena to try to protect her. Like she's got this person that's keeping her from going that far down. But that's where it becomes to me, an interesting question of like, is it mother daughter following in mom's footsteps? Or is it, this is just a role model that I don't want to follow that I used to look up to, but now could very well become me.

[23:03] Robin Masella: Yeah, absolutely. Both, both of those things, I think work for the, for the intent of how she feels towards her.

[23:19] Mike Abrams: I love it. I it's fun because like, I've definitely clearly now, like me and the fans have spent more time thinking about this and it's like, yeah, yeah, this is what I think. I want you to tell me what you think, like all the amazing things that you've heard. Cause I'm sure you've heard so many episodes.

[23:36] Robin Masella: Yeah. When we, when we, when we stop recording, I'll give you a couple of the things I've made up that I've said many times on here that I'm like, my joke has been, and I'm, I'm my goal one day is to do it. And I don't know if I'm, I'm making, I might get the opportunity. My goal is to just go tell the tour or current cast or some version of like, here's what I think you should think of that won't change the show. Cause like, none of this is stuff that's going to dramatically change the show, but like, I want to go and say, Hey, Victoria, Griz is your mom tonight. When she comes out, I want you to just look at her as if that's your mom. And that's the only difference. This rest of this stuff is going to change, but I have like one for every cast that I want to be like, here's what I think you can go do tonight.

And I want to hear if it lands or if it doesn't land, because there is so many versions of this that could be like, you could go on and say, she's mom tonight. She's not mom tomorrow. Monk is brother today. Monk is love interest tomorrow. Like there's just so, so many opportunities to kind of tinker with it. That does not change the plot. Does not change the story. Does not change the dancing and singing, but changes maybe a little bit of the energy that night. And I would assume helps as an actor doing it eight times a week.

[24:45] Robin Masella: Oh yeah. Yeah. It makes it fun and fresh, but also keeps it in the confines of the show.

[24:49] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Yeah. And the only people I'll notice are the super fans. Cause there are a group of fans that will, that will recognize that. And then the rest of the group is going to be like me my first time, which is just like, what the fuck did I just watch? Yeah. You know, like, I don't know what I'm experiencing here, here. I couldn't have named half the cats for you, let alone the relationship with each other on stage.

[25:14] Robin Masella: Right. Right. Oh no, the super fans are real. I mean, we, I'm sure you've had lots of encounters with them, but we had a group of people who I think came to every show or at least three a week, sometimes in costume and makeup and got, got to know people in the cast, got to come backstage sometimes. They called themselves the junkyard. And I've interviewed one from the junkyard and they saw the show 88 times. Wow. Did the math and that's 15% of the performances that went on on the revival. And so, yeah, there, I mean, but the thing is they're super fans and they're so fun for me to talk to because they have an opinion on what the definitive answer to these things are, whether the cast or the people agree, they have their version.

And so it's my favorite question. I always ask them is where am I wrong? Like, what am I getting wrong? Cause I don't know. I just am kind of saying, here's what I'm seeing, or I've heard enough variations of this that I think could happen and they are passionate and it's fun.

[26:16] Robin Masella: Yeah. Yep. It's super fun.

[26:20] Mike Abrams: We'll be back for more of this cat's catastrophe after a short break.

[26:28] Mike Abrams: So I want to pivot because you are going to be going into Bad Cinderella, Andrew Webber's new show on Broadway. By the time that this is released, I hope we'll hopefully be in previews in there, but I know you're in rehearsals right now. So what, you know, how has, what has one, that experience been being in another Andrew Webber show? And then two, what have like, what can someone expect to come see it? Especially this is a lot of cat's fans, but I think this is also a lot of just theater and Andrew Webber fans. What is the show going to bring to the Broadway stage?

[27:00] Robin Masella: Yeah. This is my third Andrew Webber show now. I did the national tour of Evita and Cats on Broadway and now Bad Cinderella. And I think what he's amazing at, I mean, he's amazing at a lot of things, but is just having big sweeping scores and the music just goes on and on and just is big and lush. And this is one of those musicals, a little more edgy, a little more modern. But the music is just beautiful. And I think in terms of what I've seen so far, the sets are big and colorful and bright. The costumes are again, colorful and big and bright. It's just going to be kind of like a bang of a show. Very different from what they did in London because they did the show in London and I think they learned a lot and it was a great production for them.

But they've made some changes, both musically, visually and artistically. And I think it's just going to be, it's a spin on the fairy tale of Cinderella. So it's not the same Cinderella as the Rodgers and Hammerstein Cinderella story. She's an outcast and a bit edgier and doesn't really care until she does. Um, there's some fun storyline things that I can't really give away, but are definitely different.

[28:32] Robin Masella: And a little shocking in moments. So you got to come see the show to find out. Um, and yeah, I just think it's, it's a mixture of like a good old fashioned musical, but mixed with kind of a modern edgy feel. Those are the two words that I kind of always come back to because it's, it's, um, yeah, it's going to be a little different than what you think it is.

[28:54] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I, um, it's, I was going to ask you about the, cause I know that there was the, the West End version, but I know this is different. It seems like this is, you know, some parts the same, but this is a new version of that. Cause there was a lot of changes to this. Um, and then it's the same thing. It's like, it's Cinderella, which most people are, I would hope most people are gonna know that story, but it's not what you're going to see. It's a, it's a different play using the characters and the source material as a, I would say an anchor, but not like exactly what the, you know, you're just not going to see a version of it.

[29:30] Robin Masella: Yeah. No, it's, it's a completely, it's a reinvented version of Cinderella. You know, there's still the Cinderella who's a bit of an outcast and doesn't get accepted. And, um, in the original production, you know, Prince Charming is the Prince that she eventually, you know, falls in love with. And that's shifted a little bit. There's another Prince, Prince Sebastian, who's Prince Charming's brother, who we find out is also a bit of an outcast and doesn't really like his position and want to be in his position. Um, and how that relationship, that relationship kind of unfolds and comes together. And, um, yeah, I think it's, I think it's going to still have that same fairy tale, you know, fable feeling to it, but in a different way. Um, but, and also with, you know, beautiful score by Andrew Lloyd Webber, because he just writes beautiful music.

[30:23] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I am very excited to see it. I know we will link and anybody in New York should go see it and come see it. I, I have been, uh, for, it's been weeks now and, you know, we're recording this long before the show's open. I've seen the, the, the signage is up on the theater and it's like, I walked a bunch of times. So it's, it's, uh, it's out there and people are eager to see previews and, um, everything for it to open here. Uh, when it does.

[30:47] Robin Masella: Yeah. Yeah. They're the, our press team is amazing. And they're, you know, they're already doing interviews with the cast and photos, press photos. And we had our little housewives, um, press not release, but, you know, press social media videos that are going around to just kind of give a sense of a little bit of the show.

[31:06] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Even the, uh, announcement kind of made a bang on social media because of the, you know, the, the way they teased it. I'm not a TikTok influencer, so I didn't get the personal invite. Um, but I know a lot of the theater influencers got the invites and then they, you know, the whole kind of like introduction, it was, it was very well conceived and definitely created a buzz, which is, which has made it fun. And I think it's, I like, anytime I hear edgy and modern, like, I think that that's a fun way to take something, especially Disney, you know, something that's, that's been done and is a known story to take a different look on it. And then to your point, adding Andrew Lloyd Webber's, uh, talent to add to it will make it so fun.

[31:49] Robin Masella: Absolutely. I think it's a fine line when you're reinventing a story that everybody knows so well that, you know, the option is to either do a complete 180 and make it completely different. Um, which is not exactly what's happening in this version, but it's an, it's enough of the same and enough different, or I feel like people who really love the pure story of Cinderella will be interested in understand it. And people who are kind of sick and tired of that same old Cinderella fairy tale story are going to have some new elements to get them excited and into it.

[32:25] Mike Abrams: That's fun. Well, it is, uh, by the time this releases, it'll either be opened or opening soon. Um, so I encourage anybody again, who's in New York or anybody who has the means and the ability to go see that Cinderella, we'll link everything to, um, so you can get tickets. Uh, I want to shift to some rapid fire, some ending things. So we can talk about the most important question on this podcast, which is the joke of choice. But before we get there, um, if you could go on for one cat for any night, forget male, female, vocal range, dance, whatever, just, you could go on for one track, one night, who would you want to go on it?

[33:02] Robin Masella: Oh, Tugger. Tugger, absolutely. Just the freedom to do whatever the hell you want to do on stage within the confines of what was given. But I mean, there were moments where Tyler Haynes, who was our amazing Tugger, um, I would just look over and he'd be like licking his leg up on the top of the oven, you know? And cause he just doesn't give a shit. He's like, not Tyler, but the character, like that character just doesn't give a shit. He thinks he's a hot as shit and like, he can just do whatever the hell he wants and gets like a little bit of freedom of that. Um, which I thought would just be so fun to do. It's the one character that really has a lot of creative license more so than I think most of us, the cats where you have like your, you know, you have your swim lanes, I'll call it that you can stay with it.

But it seems like Tyler, I've talked to Tyler about this. He can kind of just go do whatever he wants. Like when he took the, he went to the crowd and he was like comments on YouTube, like sat in people's laps and he like ate the popcorn and then like, whatever. He could do whatever he wanted. So I love that answer. It's everything that of my social media and everything, it's all named Rum Tum Tugger. Everything is that. So I agree. That would be my answer.

[34:15] Mike Abrams: Yes. Um, who are your favorite and least favorite cats? Not characters, not they're not a characters, not actors. Always clarify that.

[34:20] Robin Masella: My favorite and least favorite. I mean, I'm partial, I'm obviously partial to Demeter and Bomb because I just love their characters. Um, uh, Mongo, Jerry and Rumpelteazer, I think are just kind of annoying and I would never want to play them.

[34:42] Mike Abrams: Yeah. They were kind of like the annoying kittens.

[34:45] Robin Masella: Yeah. That's the song that got stuck in my head the most.

[34:52] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Yeah. To sing, to listen to, or just in general?

[34:59] Robin Masella: All of the above, just from the show. Oh gosh. I mean, I love Macavity cause I love singing it, but I love, um, we call it little memory or it's a top of act two where all the cats sing a little bit of memory. And from a personal point of view, we're all kind of just, you know, the staging is that we're all kind of later on the stage and close to the audience and we're just singing out to the audience. And it's kind of the only one time, the one time in the show where of course you're performing cause you're on a stage and you're performing, but it was like the smallest amount of performing. And for me as an actor to just look out into the audience and be able to look at people's faces. And I always kind of pictured myself as a little girl sitting in the audience, watching myself on stage or watching someone on stage.

I always, I love in shows when you have those kinds of quiet moments of just looking out into the audience and having that connection or just being able to have a moment of like gratitude for me, that was always a really special moment in the show and a special song to sing. And you get to sing a little bit of memory, which, you know, who doesn't want to sing memory?

[36:08] Mike Abrams: Yeah, that's, it's kind of interesting to hear that. Cause it was a show where there's so much going on on stage at all times to have kind of that quieter moment. That's not the intense, like piece of Griswold come back on stage, you know, type of thing is yeah. Super interesting. I love hearing that. My last rapid fire question before the most important one, if you could cast one of the cats in Bad Cinderella, who would fit best in the story?

[36:34] Robin Masella: Oh, that's a good one. I can cast one of the cats in Bad Cinderella. Okay. I want to think about this for a second. It would have to be bomb. It would have to be Bomb Bell Arena because yeah. Yeah. Well, the town of Belleville where Bad Cinderella takes place is everything is perfect. And anyone who's different, like does not belong. And we're very sure about that. And we're very confident and we're very put together and, and sexy and beautiful. And so to me, that just kind of encompasses what bomb is. She's just kind of a confident, strong, sexy cat. Yeah. I think when you said your explanation earlier was modern edgy and confident and a little bit more like I immediately thought, oh, that's Cinderella's Bomb Bell Arena. Like it's exactly like that. So I agree. And I will, I will revisit this with you after I get to see the show and I will.

[37:37] Mike Abrams: Yeah. Yeah. Everybody with you. Okay. The most important question. Yeah. I have argued at length that I don't think Grizabella is the right Jellicle choice. So I want to hear, do you want to defend Grizabella or are you going to defend somebody else as your Jellicle choice?

[37:47] Robin Masella: I always thought that she was the right choice because in my mind, she's like gone through some horrible things and is the outcast of this group. And I don't know, she sings a really amazing song. So like who wouldn't deserve to get to be reborn again after singing that?

[38:16] Mike Abrams: It's clear the more I talk to cast members that a lot of you have just as like, yeah, I never thought a different version because it's like you did this for hundreds of times, you know, you got to go on and choose her. And then there's some who are like, oh no, especially like a giant alarm is like, like I'm picking guests. But here's my theory for you now. And this is a new thing I hadn't thought about until you talked about earlier. I think that there's a, you want Grizabella as Demeter because you are on her same path. And since the heavyset layer is a reward and something that's like desirable as Demeter, you're following her so much in the sense that like you had your, you went off in the cavity, you know, if you, this might be your future. And so it's like, I want to pick her because when I come back and I have that moment, I don't want to not get picked myself.

[39:10] Robin Masella: Yeah, maybe that makes a lot of sense. Yeah. After hearing that, that makes a lot of sense. You're just like, I just, she came back and she sings it and I was fine with it.

[39:21] Mike Abrams: Yeah. I mean, I also think like, you know, you're taught that like that is the one who was deserving. But I mean, I could see how Gus, cause Gus is like such a grandfather of, of everyone, you know, and I could see how he would deserve it, but I don't know. I think Grizabella was the right choice. I think she's, in my mind, she's gone through like such ups and downs in her life as a cat that she deserves to come back one more time.

[39:47] Robin Masella: I agree with that wholeheartedly. But I do think that she should stay for the year and go next year. Spend time with the fam. Have a birthday. Go to Thanksgiving, you know, like, get to do a year's worth of what you've missed and then go next year.

[40:05] Mike Abrams: Right. All right. Well, maybe in the revival or in the, not the revival, but you know, Cats Part 2. Cats 2. I have a lot of cats.

[40:12] Robin Masella: It'll start with her not getting picked and being forced to stay for another year and see what happens then. I still think the best Cats 2 is she gets picked, but you get a Ghost of Christmas past version where she goes and sees the impact of her being picked and comes back and decides if she wants to still go. That's what I think there's a lot. A lot you can do with that as material, because then you can play into all of the different unknown relationships that you can take a step further the next night or later on that she can come back and see by her not getting picked. Like, does Gus make it into next year? Maybe we have to go to his funeral. Like, does, what happens to Macavity? Like, there's a lot of different things you can come back to see with that her decision being made.

[40:55] Robin Masella: You're on to something there.

[40:57] Mike Abrams: The challenge is I don't know how to write anything musically. I cannot choreograph anything and just have a very raw idea that I would love somebody to run with.

[41:07] Robin Masella: And if someone wants to, I'll happily consult.

[41:09] Mike Abrams: It would be an interesting book, you know, for like those people that, you know, you could like go through the whole, these are the different backstories that I've heard of Cats, which I'm sure a lot of people would be surprised about. And then, you know, this is what would happen if we change the ending.

[41:26] Robin Masella: Yeah. One day, one day. Until then, I'm going to keep having everybody tell me the telephone of Cats until we get slightly closer to a definitive answer.

[41:36] Mike Abrams: I can't wait till episode 400, where it's just all over the place.

[41:40] Robin Masella: If I'm at 400, I have other questions.

[41:45] Mike Abrams: This has been so fun. How can people stay in touch with you? Everything else you're doing? Obviously, I'll link the Bad Cinderella stuff, but social media, I can follow you.

[41:53] Robin Masella: Yeah. Follow me on Instagram at Robin Masella. That's my name. I post a lot of, you know, theater career stuff. And I try to post as much insider backstage things as I can when I'm doing a show. So that's always fun to share with people.

[42:08] Mike Abrams: Awesome. We'll link everything there as well. This has been so fun. Thank you so much for coming on and excited to see you in Bad Cinderella.

[42:17] Robin Masella: Yeah. Come see us at the Imperial.

[42:19] Mike Abrams: Amazing. And thanks, everyone else, for listening to this episode of The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of the cat's atrophy. To follow along, you can subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, or anywhere else to listen to podcasts. Follow us on Twitter, Instagram, and TikTok at TheWrongCatDied or check out our website, TheWrongCatDied.com.