This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:00] Heather Vickery: Okay, finish this sentence. Taking a chance is the only way to live.

[0:06] Alan Seales: Hell yeah. I love that.

[0:22] Heather Vickery: Get ready. Okay. Hi, everyone. Welcome to Was It Chance?, the podcast about embracing opportunity and taking intentional risk for your creative life. I'm Heather Vickery.

[0:29] Alan Seales: And I'm Alan Seales. Heather and I started off as two perfect strangers, and we met by chance, and we embraced opportunity, and we made a podcast. And now you, the listener, get to listen as we chat with other successful people about the risks they've taken to put themselves on a path to creative success. How's that?

[0:50] Heather Vickery: It was like five different announcer Alan voices in that intro.

[0:53] Alan Seales: You're listening to Was It Chance?

[0:55] Heather Vickery: Wow.

[0:56] Alan Seales: He's an actor.

[0:59] Heather Vickery: What's your... Give me your announcer voice. Give me Coming This Summer.

[1:03] Alan Seales: Coming This Summer. I don't have a good announcer voice.

[1:06] Heather Vickery: No, that was good. That was good. Okay. Talk about the Devil Wears Prada 3 that's going to happen in the old folks home where Miranda is so angry and jaded that she's turning everybody into her own private staff in the retirement village.

[1:23] Alan Seales: That's a plot?

[1:24] Heather Vickery: Yeah. I was like, I just saw Devil Wears Prada 2. We saw it in the theater.

[1:28] Alan Seales: Well, I'm already writing 3, obviously. It's happening...

[1:31] Heather Vickery: You're obviously writing 3, obviously.

[1:32] Alan Seales: It's happening in real time.

[1:33] Heather Vickery: Are there powers that be listening to you? That's what I really want to know.

[1:36] Alan Seales: Look, everybody listens to us.

[1:38] Heather Vickery: What made you come up with... Of all the things, all the movies that came out over the summer, what made you go with Devil Wears Prada 3?

[1:43] Alan Seales: Because Krystal was wearing...

[1:46] Heather Vickery: That's a new Spider-Man?

[1:48] Alan Seales: Was watching 2, yes, last night. And it's fresh in my brain space.

[1:53] Heather Vickery: Okay. Have you seen Spider-Man Return? Or no?

[1:56] Alan Seales: Brand New Day?

[1:57] Heather Vickery: No.

[1:58] Alan Seales: Brand New Day?

[1:58] Heather Vickery: Not yet.

[1:59] Alan Seales: All the names.

[2:00] Heather Vickery: I just watched it because it was on... What? As we're recording, Brand New Day just came out this week, last weekend. And what's the one where Andrew Garfield and Tobey Maguire came in into the multiverse? That one, I just watched for the first time over the weekend because I wanted to catch up.

[2:17] Alan Seales: So I don't know, but my daughters, all of them, but especially my 16-year-old are really, really obsessed with Marvel. Their dad got them super into it.

[2:28] Heather Vickery: And we were in Mexico City to see Harry Styles when the movie came out. And she was like, I'm going to have to delete social media because I don't want to get any spoilers.

[2:37] Alan Seales: But guess what we discovered when we got there? It released two days early in Mexico than it did in the US.

[2:42] Heather Vickery: Because of the internet.

[2:44] Alan Seales: So we got to see it in Mexico City.

[2:46] Heather Vickery: It grew in Mexico and came to the United States?

[2:48] Alan Seales: Yeah, sure.

[2:49] Heather Vickery: Yeah, cool.

[2:49] Alan Seales: Let's go with that.

[2:50] Heather Vickery: Why did they do... Do they do that? But seriously, is that like a...

[2:53] Alan Seales: You're so weird.

[2:54] Heather Vickery: I know. Is that like a thing where... Like in America, movies come out on Fridays. In other countries, do they come out on different days?

[3:01] Alan Seales: I don't know. Google it. That's what you'd tell me.

[3:06] Heather Vickery: Listen.

[3:07] Alan Seales: I've literally no idea.

[3:08] Heather Vickery: You're just there.

[3:09] Alan Seales: I know, but I don't know if that's a thing that happens all the time. I just know that this movie released on Wednesday and we got to see it on Thursday.

[3:18] Heather Vickery: So all you listeners...

[3:18] Alan Seales: And it was a big ordeal to find it in English and not dubbed over.

[3:24] Heather Vickery: It did have Spanish subtitles.

[3:25] Alan Seales: Oh, interesting.

[3:26] Heather Vickery: But we had to make sure we could see it in English.

[3:28] Alan Seales: Interesting. Oh, have you ever been to an Alamo draft house? You know that chain?

[3:32] Heather Vickery: No. I've never even heard of it.

[3:33] Alan Seales: Really? Oh, I don't know if it's just a New York thing. It's a chain here where you can have reclining seats and they serve you food in your seat. So you show up early.

[3:38] Heather Vickery: We have versions of that.

[3:44] Alan Seales: And they do versions of movies where they have open captions. They have captions turned on.

[3:52] Heather Vickery: So I love going to watch those movies because in the quiet moments or if there's names that I can't understand, I'm reading things at the same time. So the plot sticks better.

[4:04] Alan Seales: A secret guest who we haven't announced yet. Are you yes or no on closed captions?

[4:09] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Oh, for life?

[4:10] Alan Seales: Yeah, for life.

[4:11] Megan Minutillo Weiner: In our house? Oh, we're a yes.

[4:12] Alan Seales: On Netflix, you turn them on.

[4:13] Megan Minutillo Weiner: We're totally a yes.

[4:15] Alan Seales: Yeah. My partner loves captions. I find them very distracting.

[4:21] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I don't watch the movie. I read the captions. I can't do both at the same time.

[4:25] Alan Seales: I don't know why I can. It's definitely my husband was the driving force of that.

[4:29] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I think it started when we were watching Peaky Blinders.

[4:33] Alan Seales: Oh, yeah.

[4:33] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Not the show, but...

[4:34] Alan Seales: Oh, I can't understand any of it.

[4:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Nope. If there's a difficult accent, I can do it, but I'm very distracted.

[4:44] Alan Seales: One of my favorite things to watch with captions open is Hamilton on Disney+. The pro shot.

[4:50] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Sure.

[4:50] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[4:51] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Because I'm like, there's lyrics. I've been listening to that cast album for years, and I still go back every time. I'm like, oh, that's the word. That's the phrase. Lynn, you lyrical genius. You did it again.

[5:01] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[5:02] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Like...

[5:02] Alan Seales: That's funny.

[5:03] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. Anyway, but...

[5:04] Heather Vickery: Hey, Alan, do you want to tell folks who are mysterious voices?

[5:08] Alan Seales: Mysterious voice. I would love to. Our guest is coming this summer is Megan Minutillo-Wiener, and she's a writer, a poet, and a Tony Award nominated producer. We need to talk because I'm raising for Happy Feet right now, whose creative career spans theater, publishing, and digital media. She received a Tony nom as a producer of Operation Mincemeat. And I've also interviewed half that cast. Okay, we need to talk.

[5:35] Megan Minutillo Weiner: She's the creator of the critically acclaimed cabaret series Moms Night Out, Duets and Women of the Wings, and her essays and poetry have appeared in Coffee and Crumbs, The Periwinkle Pelican, Thought Catalog, Hello Rescripted, and other publications. Megan also writes the weekly sub stack newsletter Good Attention, where she explores creativity, motherhood, and the writing life. She's currently working on her first novel and lives in New York, just near me. Welcome, Megan.

[6:04] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Hi, guys.

[6:05] Heather Vickery: Thanks for being patient with us, Megan.

[6:07] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No, it's fine. It's the first time I've ever heard my bio read out loud to me. Like, that was a trip.

[6:13] Alan Seales: I was thinking about just thinking it in my head, but I didn't figure it would have the same effect.

[6:17] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It doesn't. The audience can't. The telepathy AI code hasn't started working yet. I'm sure Alan's working on it.

[6:24] Alan Seales: Alan's going to develop something.

[6:26] Heather Vickery: Listen. What got you into producing? I love... I want to dive in there.

[6:30] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I am a producer, yeah.

[6:33] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Um, what got me into producing? I started producing my own cabaret series when I was a substitute teacher. So I sort of networked that way. And through that, I really liked it. Somebody once called me more of a creative producer. I like pairing this writer with this actor. And like, you're a music director who should meet this composer.

[7:02] Alan Seales: That's just called a lead producer.

[7:04] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, I guess that's it. I gotta own that, right?

[7:06] Alan Seales: Yeah, that's just a lead producer.

[7:09] Megan Minutillo Weiner: So I guess, yeah, that's the dream. But it took me a while to figure out like that. But that was, you know, my thing. I thought I wanted to direct for a while. And I still like doing that. But the lead producing is more of what makes me happy. Somebody recently asked me if, you know, what did I want to do when I was a teenager? Like, what job did I want to have? And I was like, actually, I'm like living that life, which is kind of nuts, because I guess not a lot of people get to say that. But I was like, I always wanted to be in the entertainment business. I always wanted to really be in theater. I saw my first Broadway show when I was six. So my parents tell the story about my face, sort of lighting up.

And my dad was like, Oh, here we go. Transfixed. And then I was asked to be an investor originally for Mincemeat. And I, God bless those who think I have that kind of capital, but I didn't. So I was like, I can't do that right now. If I could, I would, you know, preschool.

[8:11] Alan Seales: And there, done that.

[8:12] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Well, like right now I got a mortgage and I got preschool tuition. So the excess isn't quite there. But I want to do this as a career. So I would love to get that first Broadway credit. So if there's an opportunity for a co-producing slot, sign me up. And there was, and I made the raise.

[8:32] Alan Seales: So correct me if I'm wrong, Broadway producing is one of the few legal SEC pyramid schemes.

[8:42] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No comment. No comment.

[8:44] Alan Seales: I mean, as someone who has been lead producing and co-producing for a few years, that's what I tell people.

[8:50] Megan Minutillo Weiner: There we go.

[8:51] Alan Seales: I literally do it as part of my pitch. I'm like, you don't have to spend any of your money. All you got to do is raise money from others and you earn from it. That's a pyramid scheme. The SEC says it's okay.

[8:59] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You know what, I never thought of it that way, Alan, but you know, you're not wrong.

[9:02] Alan Seales: Yep. Welcome to Broadway producing. And if you're a lead producer, you're several levels up. So it becomes a, what is it? Multi MMA, multi-marketing, whatever it is. I don't know.

[9:12] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Oh, the MLM.

[9:13] Alan Seales: MLM, yeah.

[9:14] Alan Seales: Multi-level marketing.

[9:15] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. Not MMA fighting.

[9:17] Alan Seales: I did that at 1.2 for skincare.

[9:19] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Did you?

[9:22] Alan Seales: Which skincare? Was it Arbonne?

[9:23] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It was Rodan and Fields. I don't even know if they exist anymore.

[9:26] Alan Seales: They had a big, they blew up, but there was a big literal explosion in the company.

[9:33] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. Controversy. And I think, but they might be back. I'm not sure either.

[9:37] Alan Seales: I mean, I don't really do it anymore. It wasn't actually my, it wasn't my jam.

[9:41] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It wasn't your passion.

[9:43] Alan Seales: Fair enough.

[9:45] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Power to those who love it, you know, love that for you. But that's just not my thing.

[9:53] Alan Seales: I tried it.

[9:54] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Speaking of your thing, though, you're multi-passionate, right?

[9:58] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I am.

[9:59] Alan Seales: You're checking off a lot of boxes, producer, writer, poet, creator, and now a novelist. Was there a point where you felt, where you feel pressure to pick one lane, or do you just kind of love juggling all those balls?

[10:13] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I love juggling all those balls. I do feel pressure to pick one lane sometimes because people, I think, don't. I think it's getting better understanding that sometimes in the creative field, people do more than one thing. But I think when you're in school, when you're in grad school, it's everybody encourages you to sort of stay in one lane. And then when you start branching out, everybody's like, wait, wait a minute. You're supposed to be an actor. You're supposed to be a writer. How dare you do both? So I try to keep reminding myself. I think my brain works best when I'm doing multiple things at once. I don't like doing the same thing every day.

[10:50] Alan Seales: I have no idea what that's like.

[10:53] Megan Minutillo Weiner: He does. It's funny. I don't like doing the same thing every day either, but I do like some structure and routine with kind of a... If you ever had one of those jars for your kids, you're like, we're going to pick an activity or we're going to pick a chore. I want to have my options in there each day and be like, okay, and what do I want to do to fill this time slot today?

[11:15] Alan Seales: So I like the day to be structured, but what I do with my time in that structure, I like to change.

[11:21] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I thought you meant like, I keep your kids in a jar. I said, yeah, I do.

[11:25] Alan Seales: Yeah, I'm sure that's what you thought I meant.

[11:27] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I poke holes in the top so they don't suffocate.

[11:28] Alan Seales: You poke holes in the top. Is it Trail of Tears that you let out?

[11:34] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No, I'm thinking Inside Out where you bottle up your emotions and you put everything inside the bottle. Yeah, no.

[11:40] Alan Seales: I love that one.

[11:40] Megan Minutillo Weiner: That's a terrible joke. He's named his kids after presidents, sort of.

[11:49] Alan Seales: I have no clue where you're going with this.

[11:51] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You don't remember we talked about this?

[11:53] Alan Seales: No, I do not.

[11:55] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No?

[11:55] Alan Seales: No.

[11:56] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Jackson, we joked, he was named after Andrew Jackson. He's not. He's not named after Andrew Jackson.

[12:00] Alan Seales: Oh, oh, oh, my kids.

[12:01] Megan Minutillo Weiner: So I called him your kids. Trail of Tears, Trail of Tears.

[12:05] Alan Seales: Same page. Okay, we're good.

[12:07] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yes, Trail of Tears, Seals. That's, yes, I remember that now.

[12:12] Alan Seales: You guys, where's HBO? You two need your own special.

[12:17] Megan Minutillo Weiner: From your mouth to God's ears.

[12:22] Alan Seales: Yes, I would be nice.

[12:22] Megan Minutillo Weiner: As my grandmother would say.

[12:23] Alan Seales: We could start making some money off this podcast. It would be a good start.

[12:26] Megan Minutillo Weiner: And we make some money.

[12:29] Alan Seales: Okay, so six years old, saw your first Broadway show, and then you always knew, I wanted to be a cabaret, or you wanted to be on Broadway, yes?

[12:34] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I wanted to make my own work.

[12:38] Alan Seales: You wanted to be involved.

[12:41] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I wanted to be involved. I didn't know in what capacity. I started a website when I was teaching called the rightteachers.com, W-R-I-T-E.

[12:51] Alan Seales: Clever.

[12:52] Megan Minutillo Weiner: And I had gotten my master's in theater education. So I was like, I'm going to graduate with my master's. I'm going to buy an apartment on the Upper West Side. Are we laughing yet? I'm going to write at night. I'm going to direct when I feel like. I'm going to teach the children of Manhattan. It's all going to be great.

[13:13] Alan Seales: I watched way too much Sex and the City when I was in my 20s.

[13:18] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You know, I had this picture of what was going to happen. And I graduated in 2008. It was impossible to get a job teaching math, let alone teaching theater.

[13:31] Alan Seales: So then I went a different sort of route.

[13:37] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I was teaching, substitute teaching at the district where my dad was working, and then was just sort of trying to find my footing. I was like, okay, this path of teaching, maybe that's not for me, or maybe the universe is trying to tell me something else. So, I made this website, it's really, you know, blogs are very in, I was like, I'm going to interview people who work in just media in general. And I scoured the Playbill vault, because I was like, we're close to New York City. I was like, let me just start there. And I started emailing and asking for interviews for anybody who would talk to me. And I, my off days would go to Schmackeries, and I would sit and I would ask them questions, and then I would transcribe, and I would post the articles, and then I would get people to review books and different.

[14:28] Alan Seales: Did you do interviews at Schmackeries?

[14:29] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah.

[14:30] Alan Seales: That's funny. Schmackeries, Heather, do you know what Schmackeries is?

[14:36] Heather Vickery: Nope.

[14:36] Alan Seales: Me?

[14:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No, Heather. Heather.

[14:37] Alan Seales: I was like, yeah, I do.

[14:39] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Do you know the place where you used to go?

[14:41] Alan Seales: Do you know the place? I was like, I don't know, Alex.

[14:43] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No, Schmackeries is, they're a cookie, a special, they're privately owned, right?

[14:49] Alan Seales: I think they're still around.

[14:50] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, so Schmackeries has a kind of cool origin story. Maybe if we talk enough about Schmackeries, they'll start sponsoring one of your...

[14:56] Alan Seales: Yeah, start sponsoring us, Schmackeries, and we can have you on the show, too.

[15:00] Megan Minutillo Weiner: So Schmackeries was started by a career Broadway performer, and they were, you know, an ensemble sort of triple threat, and then one day decided that they didn't want to do that anymore, and then started a tiny cookie company. And it is on 43rd, I believe, between 8th and 9th. It's this teeny, teeny, tiny spot, but they have enough for a couple of bistro tables, and they have their little outside stuff, and they make these really boujee-y, lovely cookies. You know, things like chocolate chip and bacon, or some kind of fun, funfetti thing, and everything's got a theme. It's almost as big as your face kind of deal.

[15:41] Alan Seales: Yeah, they do these weird, just weird cookies.

[15:44] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, really out-of-the-box flavors that you're like, that sounds crazy. That's like marshmallow in Pinkie Toe, but it's really good, you know?

[15:54] Alan Seales: Now I want cookies.

[15:55] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yep, yep.

[15:55] Alan Seales: I haven't eaten yet today.

[15:58] Megan Minutillo Weiner: And it was, you know, if you see some theaters will, like, have them at their concession sales now, and it was a place for me to just work, and they were great. And it wasn't always Schmackeries, it was a lot of it was the time, because I was interviewing a lot of actors and composers and stuff like that. So that was a good location for people to come and sort of meet. And then through that, I met a lot of composers, and I was like, you know, your music's really good. Will you let me try to make this into a cabaret with a theme? I would always like a good theme. So sometimes it would be a benefit for Planned Parenthood, or sometimes I would write monologues that I felt would lead really good into the songs and sort of create these evenings of music. And the first one I ever did was at Don't Tell Mama's in the backpack room. It's like, like 15 seats or something.

[17:00] Alan Seales: Oh, I love Don't Tell Mama's. Yeah.

[17:01] Megan Minutillo Weiner: That's awesome.

[17:02] Alan Seales: But I loved it. You know, Sidney, the general manager over there, he was awesome. And, you know, let me sort of play and try. So I tried like a lot of different random ideas. And I was like, let's see if this works. And sometimes it would, and sometimes it wouldn't. But I guess that's how the producing thing started. I was like, I like being the boss and bringing all of it together.

[17:27] Heather Vickery: We're going to take a quick break. Stay tuned for more of the episode. And now we're back. So was there a moment, the through line for this show is taking intentional risk for creative success. Was there a moment where you were like, oh, my God, I'm going to take this risk or something that you thought would work that didn't that led to something awesome?

[17:51] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Um, yeah, a lot of it. I think the whole reason I'm on this podcast, I wrote a note on Substack about like, before I was like a Broadway producer, I did, you know, A, B, C, D, E, F, G. And I think sometimes you go to school, you get the BFA, you get the MFA, and you think it's going to be like a linear path.

[18:12] Alan Seales: Um, and it's not.

[18:14] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Never.

[18:14] Alan Seales: No, progress is never linear.

[18:17] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No. Um, I think the first big moment was I had gotten a maternity leave replacement teaching theater at a district on Long Island. And then when that was done, I was like, okay, do you continue to do this? Or do you step away? And I stepped away. I like, I'd finally gotten the experience you need to probably get a better teaching job. And I applied for the Stage Directors and Choreographers Observership Program. And I got in, and it was in the middle of a school year. And I was like, I've got to try, you know, because I don't want to be 85 and being like, damn, I wish I could have.

[18:54] Alan Seales: 80s, okay, 85.

[18:57] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It's okay. You know, you could do a lot in those five years.

[19:00] Alan Seales: That's right.

[19:01] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Between 80 and 85.

[19:01] Alan Seales: You never know.

[19:01] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You never know. So I didn't, I didn't want to have regret in that respect. Um, so I stepped away from public school teaching and a steady paycheck and health insurance and all that wonderful stuff. And I was like, I'm going to do theater. Um, so there's that, that was definitely a one. And then when did the writing come in more professionally and why?

[19:28] Alan Seales: So I, Medium is a platform that not a lot of people, you know, some of you guys know about it, but, um, I started with Medium because I was making money on that.

[19:35] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You were like doing paid, paid posts.

[19:40] Alan Seales: Sweet.

[19:41] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You know what? They don't even, the way their pay structure worked was it was a $5 a month membership. And then you, you were getting paid by Medium.

[19:53] Alan Seales: I don't think so. I think it's maybe the idea came, I shouldn't actually speak to that because I don't really know.

[20:00] Megan Minutillo Weiner: We met on Substack.

[20:01] Alan Seales: Yes. But at first it was like, you were getting paid for views. Um, it was the sort of readership model. And at one point it was, I was like, I'm going to sort of carve out a writing portfolio here. Um, which was good in that sense that it just made me sort of flex that writing muscle. But I was doing like two essays a week, um, you know, a thousand words per essay. And then I got pregnant and then I had my son and I was like, nobody's got time to write. Like, how am I going to do that? Um, with a teeny tiny human. And that's when I got into poetry a lot. Cause I still had ideas. Um, I think I processed heightened emotion through words. Um, my son is an IVF baby, so it took a lot to get him and then you have him.

And I definitely had a healthy dose of postpartum anxiety. And so it was just sort of needed somewhere to go. But like when you're breastfeeding at two o'clock in the morning, it's kind of hard to sit down with your laptop. And I started just jotting what would come to my brain in the notes app of my phone. Um, and then I started sharing a lot of the IVF poems and that sort of took off where.

[21:17] Alan Seales: That's cool.

[21:17] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. You know, I think it's a thing that a lot of people go through and not a lot of people talk about. And so I started just putting it out there and, um, I mean the, just the DMs, just the floodgates opened and people who I hadn't spoken to for years were sending me messages. Um, a gentleman I went to college with, he reached out and he was like, my wife and I are going through this and I haven't known how to help her. So I'm sending her your essays and I was like, hot damn, like this is okay. Like this is why I'm doing this. Um, but then, you know, I'm like, I, I just turned 40. So I think I sort of have these, whether they're good or not, these notions of like, what does it mean to be a successful writer?

What does it mean to be a successful artist? And so I started chasing that a little bit more. Cause I was like, I want a book, I want this, you know, can you, can you say that you're a writer if you don't have an agent and you know, all these sort of silly.

[22:20] Heather Vickery: Heather's got opinions on that.

[22:20] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I have so many thoughts on all, on all of that. Who's the, this is the work that I do. I'm a success and transformation coach. Right. So my immediate answer is it's just self-defined. Like, yeah, it's a great question. What does it mean? But it only matters what it means to you.

[22:33] Alan Seales: Right. Not what it means to somebody else, but let's unpack that. Like, can you be a writer if you don't have an agent? Of course you can. I know lots of people who write on Substack, they're writers, right?

[22:43] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, of course you can. It took me a while to get to that point though.

[22:49] Alan Seales: Yeah. Changing people's lives and making people feel seen and connected by writing poetry. Yeah. You're yeah. You're a writer.

[22:53] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. Thanks. Yeah. No, but I think it's pretty common to go through those questions in your head and to want some sort of sense of validation.

[23:01] Alan Seales: Yeah. That's something that you put heart and soul into matters. When we get a little bit older, I'm going to be 52 at the end of the year. We hit a point where we recognize that the validation only really counts if it's ours. I still struggle with that. And I know I'm always going to struggle with it. Somewhere between 40 and 50 for women. I don't know about men, but it's a hormonal thing and I've done a lot of reading on it. And I, and it's just a true thing where you start to, as your hormones shift, the need to be pleasing everybody else all the time literally starts to disappear. So that zero fucks phase is actually your hormonal shift and it starts in your forties. But in your fifties, you're like, I don't give a single flying fuck what everybody else thinks or wants. I love this. It makes me happy. And I'm going to do this.

[23:58] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah.

[23:58] Alan Seales: So it comes with the aging body of-

[24:03] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It comes with-

[24:04] Alan Seales: Or maybe it's the, I don't know how to say this. It probably will come out stereotypical.

[24:13] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Tread lightly.

[24:15] Alan Seales: I am. I'm treading very lightly. Don't tread on me. I'm a snake.

[24:18] Megan Minutillo Weiner: So perimenopause, menopause, this time of women's lives where the emotional need to reproduce is waning and therefore-

[24:26] Alan Seales: It's not an emotional need. It's a physical need.

[24:37] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Sure.

[24:38] Alan Seales: I think there's a difference because the emotional need might not wane.

[24:42] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Interesting.

[24:43] Alan Seales: Let's say you enter into perimenopause and you haven't had children and you've wanted to. And there are plenty of women who don't want to. And sometimes I'm jealous that I didn't want to be a woman who didn't have children. I love my children. I'd do anything for them. But I look at their lifestyles and the people traveling the world. I'm like, God, that would have been nice. So I don't know that it's emotional, but the physical does shift because you can't help it.

[25:11] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Right. Your body just says, we don't need to spit out tiny alien spawn anymore. Yeah. Okay.

[25:18] Alan Seales: I never had that.

[25:18] Megan Minutillo Weiner: But hormones are... I'm sorry, Megan, that we ended up on this conversation.

[25:23] Alan Seales: Let's talk more about hormones.

[25:25] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Well, hormones are fascinating because they mask things. They make us feel certain ways, right? And our hormones shift on a weekly basis and on a monthly basis and all of that changes. And so when we stop producing them, other shit comes to the surface. We're like, oh, I never knew it was okay to only focus on myself for a little while. I never knew it was okay to not make everybody else happy all the time. Have you entered into any of those zero fucks yet, Megan? Are you there at all?

[26:00] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Me? I'm getting there. I'm an eldest daughter as well.

[26:05] Alan Seales: Oh, of how many? How many siblings?

[26:09] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It's just the two of us. It's me and my younger brother, but I fluctuate. I'm definitely a nurturer, empathetic human. I'm always in that way.

[26:22] Alan Seales: Me too.

[26:23] Megan Minutillo Weiner: But I'm also getting to the stage... I think motherhood has also made me go, if it doesn't work for my unit, we're not going to do it. I'm not going to sacrifice my mental sanity because then my mental sanity affects my kids' mental sanity. So we're not going to go there. I'm going to be there for people and we're going to show up for people. We're going to do all the things. But I'm starting to get more okay with saying no than trying to stretch myself into 20 different knots too. I think you can have it all, but I don't think you can have it all at the same time. I'm sort of okay with that as well. I was looking at my kitchen floor the other day and it's absolutely filthy. I'm letting a four-year-old crawl on that.

[27:15] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You could probably eat off of my kitchen floor before we had kids. And before, you know, it's just like a revolving door of people in my house. And I was like, I'm okay with this right now. You know, I'm gonna, I'm gonna write the poem, I'm gonna talk about a new show with people, I'm gonna take the meeting and the floor is gonna wait and my house isn't as neat as I would have hoped it would have been. But I don't care anymore. You know? Like when my things. I have four kids. And when my kids were smaller, we had a babysitter once she was a college student, and she walked in and I'm apologizing to the babysitter for the state of my house, which is ridiculous. And she goes, you know, my mom always says, if you walk into a household with kids and the house is perfect, they're probably not great parents.

Let's go with that. I like that. I'm a great dad to focus on appearance, right? They're not focused on hanging out with their kids. Yeah, whatever. Just anyway, there's pain. In the realm of you can have it all, but you can't have it all at the same time. And I have said that countless times. So I love that. How do you decide what to put your focus and energy on? So I'm thinking about like, you know, your theater-centered communities to projects like Women of the Wings and duets and building spaces for artists and the book and how do you pick? What's a yes right now? Sometimes it goes with the show schedule. I was thinking about your question when we're talking about doing the same thing every day.

And I guess my structure is, if I'm working on a show, I'm not going to be able to write the way I like to when I'm working on a show. And then I've sort of I'm okay with that, because I guess that's my flow now. Like I cannot parent the way I want to parent and write my book and produce a new show and do a concert and do all the things at the same time. The other day I said to somebody, I was like, my toxic trait is I want to get up at nine o'clock in the morning and I want to go to the gym. And I want to make my kid breakfast and maybe take him to the library and write the next The Great American Novel and cook dinner and produce the next Pulitzer Prize-winning play and do it all by dinnertime.

And it's just insanity. So I'm leaning into like one week is going to be different. A lot of it goes with a show schedule. We have a duet that's on the calendar for October 24th. So as that date starts getting closer and closer, I'm going to be curating set lists and writing press releases. And the time that I'm spending on my computer is going to be about the show because we need to put bodies in seats. And then when I have a break from a show, it's like, okay, we're going to write a little bit more. The writing, I think sometimes I need to know when to walk away from the computer. Like there was a day last week where I wrote a couple of things and they were all terrible. And what I should have done was gone to the gym or gone for a walk or, you know, did the laundry or something other than chaining myself to the chair and being like, you must output all of these words.

Because although I think writing is like a muscle that needs to be worked out, I think you also have to like live and, you know, read a book just because you're reading a book and, you know, go see a concert or just, you know, do something else that's not intrinsically tied to your work. And then the muse comes a little bit easier. I don't really know if that answers your question. I think it depends on what the calendar has. And that's kind of how I put my focus.

[30:56] Alan Seales: That's actually how I work too.

[30:58] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, it's very much how I work. It's whatever. It's kind of the squeaky wheel gets the grease, depending on the timing that the deliverables are needed to get to others. Because things shift around all the time for various reasons that are out of your control. And talking about, I don't know if this is a male thing or a me thing, could be both, that as I get older, I am more and more okay with the things that are outside of my control, as opposed to taking it.

[31:25] Alan Seales: I think that's an age thing.

[31:26] Megan Minutillo Weiner: As opposed to taking it personally that I can't control everything. You know what I mean? Like, do you feel that way? Do either of you feel that way? Or is it just a me thing?

[31:34] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[31:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Like what, in terms of work or things that you can't control?

[31:38] Alan Seales: Just in general.

[31:40] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Anything I don't have control over, I'm letting it go. Like with the kids too, like that stuff, I had this idea of the perfect dad I was going to be at all these things. And I'm like, well, because sometimes work does get in the way. Sometimes parenting gets in the way of work. Not in the way, like you choose whatever is needed. And I think that before I was like, I have to have my structure and this time and this time I'm going to deliver these. And then I can't let that get in the way. But then things happen that are outside of your control. And now I'm just like, all right, well, if I just plainly state to the others whose deadlines I missed what's going on, it is what it is and I'm okay with that.

[32:19] Alan Seales: Yeah.

[32:20] Megan Minutillo Weiner: One of my oldest friends in the world, she's got three kids and I was at her house when my son was a toddler and her daughter was trying to help with lunch and she was using a carrot, she was peeling a carrot and she nicked herself and it was like blood, every, you know, it's like, you know, oh my God, there's blood. And the kid was freaking out. And my friend was just so calm and she was like, all right, we'll get a band-aid. Like, what are you going to do? You know? And that's sort of my mantra. Sometimes I think with, definitely with parenting and with life, it's like, I'm trying the best I can. My mom is always like, you're the perfect mother. I was like, I'm not, but I'm doing the best that I can with the information that I have at the time.

I'm sure, you know, 20 years from now, he's going to tell his therapist about something and it's like, and then I'm okay with that though. Like, I'm okay with that. I'm like, I love you. This is who I was, you know, we're kind of growing together. So that's what the parenting and I, yeah, I guess with like work and theater, you know, sometimes you do a show and it gets nominated for a Tony and it's doing well. And then sometimes you do a show and it closes early and you're like, what the hell happened? But, um, I, I take comfort in like, if I know that I did the best I possibly could, um, that's the best I could do, you know, then there are those X factors, those things you can't control. Like I felt this was a good move. Sometimes it was, sometimes it's not. And you know, you can't control everything, but there's a freedom in that though.

[34:04] Alan Seales: Do you categorically have things, I mean, obviously within reason, like things that happened to your kid that your son are bigger deal than other things, but like, do you categorically with work-wise, do you have, if it happened in this bucket, I'm going to pay immediate attention to it. If it happens in that bucket, then I'm going to let it slide for a few more days or whatnot. Like, do you have tiers of what you care about?

[34:23] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Um, yeah. I mean, I think like, how do I prioritize when I'm going to attack first or like what's going to upset me first? How do you decide what to let upset you?

[34:34] Alan Seales: That's a better way of putting it. How do I decide what to let upset me?

[34:38] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Um, I don't know. You know what? I balance a lot off of my husband, honestly, because I know that I'm very sensitive and sometimes I need like an outside voice and I'll get like, this person said this and you know, like, and I'm also Italian. So I'm like yelling all the time. Um, but he will, so he will ground me in a way where I'm like, isn't this like an asshole move? And he'll say, yeah. Or he'll be like, I mean, no, I think you're just being hypersensitive. Um, and that's, I guess the way, so it's sort of like this internal thing in our household where a little gut check for me.

[35:23] Alan Seales: I'm so impressed that you could hear your husband say, I think you're being a little oversensitive and not lose your fucking mind because that would set me off so hard.

[35:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I would not, I would, I think if I'm asking for it, it's one thing if I'm asking, asking, but if you're giving me that information without me asking you for it, then, then yeah, I'm like, totally fair.

[35:49] Alan Seales: So you had mentioned, and I love this, that, you know, sometimes you work on a show and it's Tony award nominated and sometimes it closes early. Well, you, you are Tony award nominated. Tell us, I love that. I love miss me, by the way. Take us to that moment of discovering that and sort of,

[36:06] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I cried. I cried. I absolutely cried. I cried. I screamed. I was like, Oh my God. Cause there was a million moments and there's still moments in my career where I'm like, you know, should I just work at a bank or something? Like, I don't know. Like, like why am I doing this? What's happening? Why did I leave teaching? Like I should just try to get my foot back in the door. And then, you know, nobody's an overnight success. Nothing happens instantly. And to have that, you know, the first, I mean, getting the Broadway credit was a big enough deal, but then to have it be nominated for a Tony was like, just shook me to my core as the kids say. So that was awesome. And then the Tony's was like, I joke with my husband that it was better than my wedding.

[37:02] Alan Seales: I'll bet because I didn't care. I was like, I'm going in, I got childcare for the kid. My parents, I was able to bring them, which was pretty cool. Cause my dad ran a theater program at a high school for 35 years. So he's retired. So the first time he was at the Tony's was with his daughter, who's also nominated. So that was just like an out of body experience.

[37:26] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Isn't that crazy? That whole scene. I've done press and red carpet for the Tony's for a few years and it's just like, it's nuts. It's absolutely nuts. And I just was like smiling like an idiot and I didn't care. And then even just the whole getting ready, like I went in before my family, like they were coming, but I was like, nope, I want my hair to look this way. I want my makeup to look this way. I want to like sit in the hotel room and chill. I was like, peace, I'm out. Lucas has his, you know, my son's name is Lucas. So I was like, you know, you're going to be with your other set of grandparents and I just need to Zen.

[37:59] Alan Seales: Um, which I didn't even do in my own wedding. I was so worried about everybody else. I don't know. This is my day. I don't care. So it was just, it was fantastic. Um, you know, I think seeing the stuff that you don't get to see in the CBS broadcasts, like the Harvey Fierstein, um, like his speech was beautiful.

[38:19] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Um, stuff that happens in commercial breaks.

[38:22] Alan Seales: Yeah. Like it was just, it was, it was fun. It was very cool.

[38:26] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Maybe I'm still too new to this. I hope I never get to the point where I get jaded about that kind of thing. Like this is, this is great.

[38:31] Alan Seales: We're going to take a quick break. Stay tuned for more of the episode.

[38:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: And now we're back. Tell us about, I'm changing the subject a little bit. Tell us, tell us about the book that you were writing.

[38:45] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yes. Okay, guys. Buckle up. It's going to sound insane, but we wrote 30,000 words. Okay. And we, I mean, we, so like the mouse in your pocket, it's called Tuscan witch.

[39:05] Alan Seales: What'd you call me?

[39:06] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I'm already sold. I've already in, I don't even need to know anything else. I'm in, you got Italy and you got witches and I'm sold.

[39:13] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Italy and witches. My family always called me the Tuscan witch. Because like my great-grandmother, she used to like have dreams and like, they would, sometimes it would kind of happen and we're like, what's going on? And, you know, one of my sister-in-laws who's not even related to me was saying that, she goes, you know, all of us Italian, because she's also Italian, but she goes, all of us have, you know, a little like touch of witchiness, of vibes, where you just like, sort of, it's, you know, really more emotionally in tune with people. But I've been hearing that for forever. I do love the Harry Potter's concept and just witches and stuff in general. And I was like, what if we had witches that were living among us? Just sort of this like,

[40:03] Alan Seales: My favorite part, in real life.

[40:05] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, like real life. Like we're talking, like, we're in Manhattan. I'm like the girl that you see walking down the street, like, she's a witch and she knows that she has these powers, but they're kind of at bay until something terrible happens.

[40:53] Megan Minutillo Weiner: The Day Roe Vs. Wade Gets Overturned.

[41:23] Megan Minutillo Weiner: The Day Roe Vs. Wade Gets Overturned.

[41:53] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You know, it definitely needs a lot of work, but it's a fun, passion project for me.

[41:59] Heather Vickery: I think you could definitely sell it to an agent. I do. And we don't necessarily, the only agent we know does nonfiction stuff. Laura Love Harden, did you read The Many Lives of Mama Love by chance?

[42:13] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I didn't.

[42:14] Heather Vickery: That's a great, it's a great memoir.

[42:16] Megan Minutillo Weiner: The two we read.

[42:18] Heather Vickery: That's her, yeah, that's her memoir is incredible. But we meet with a ton of authors. So if you want to look back through our list of people we've interviewed, people have similar genre, maybe there's a way we can connect you and they can, I don't know.

[42:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: It's scary when I'm writing a book, but I did it. I started one day and I was like, I'm just going to do it. And we're going to see. But they keep coming back to this Tuscan witch thing. So that's kind of where we're at. So I like it. I love it. All right.

[42:51] Heather Vickery: Wait, your Substack is called Good Attention.

[42:53] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yes.

[42:55] Heather Vickery: Yeah. So just quickly tell us what that's about in case people want to connect with you there. And then we're going to do a quick fast five. And we have one final question. Yeah.

[43:05] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Good Attention is more of like a, I dip into motherhood, I dip into creativity. I write about the experiences that I have in life that sort of stick with me. Like the other day I was at Wednesday's essay is probably going to be about this gentleman I overheard at the gym, who was telling his wife, you're such a good mother. And it's in everything that you do. And I wish you would wake up in the morning and tell yourself, I'm a good mom. And I was like, Oh my god, I wanted to like hug this dude. And so that's a story that keeps resonating in my head, I think, because it's got a lot of motherhood themes and how do we show up for each other. And I'll probably turn that into an essay. So I write a poem every Monday.

I try to do a longer form essay on Wednesday. Friday, I do a Friday five, which is, you know, some of its affiliate links, like gotta get that money, honey. But it's stuff that I own, like it's, you know, I bought these new flip flops, and I really like them because they're cute. And they also don't kill my feet or my kid really love this book. And then I recently have started doing more of this Substack. I talk a lot about art that I love to so it's like this Substack was, you know, really beautiful. You should check out this essay. This podcast is wonderful. You should give it a listen. Just I like the collaboration aspect of Substack. I like I've always been that way. But just like artists in general, like it's, it can be such a solitary field to work by your inner you're creating by yourself.

So how do you find community like you guys are doing? And that kind of feels like a way to do it. And it's just the internet is full of horrible things. So I try to make it like this is good stuff that's worth your good attention. Yeah, it's fun to connect with you over there. So if anybody's on Substack, come hang out with us. Okay. Okay, I will. All right.

[45:07] Heather Vickery: Should we do our new thing? Heather? Oh, you think you get to be the first guest? We're doing a fast five with so it's quick, quick answer. First thought, don't overthink it. And we're gonna this is our first time. So if we if it doesn't go well, folks, just bear with us. We're gonna get better at it. All right. Oh, no, I'm okay. He's giving us initials right now. He's changing. Okay, so we're gonna alternate asking the questions. Are you ready? Yeah. Okay. What's one creative habit you can't live without?

[45:34] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Writing.

[45:39] Heather Vickery: What's one book that changed the way you think about creativity?

[45:41] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I don't know. I don't know. Oh, you know what the the morning pages? What is the artist? The artist way? Yep. Yeah. Okay.

[45:54] Heather Vickery: What's one piece of advice you've ignored that turned out to be the right decision not to listen to it?

[46:02] Megan Minutillo Weiner: To go for this stable job.

[46:07] Heather Vickery: Yeah, yeah. When do your best ideas usually arrive?

[46:12] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Oh, when I'm in the shower, when I'm walking, when I'm moving, or driving.

[46:19] Heather Vickery: Okay, finish this sentence. Taking a chance is the only way to live.

[46:29] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Hell yeah.

[46:30] Heather Vickery: Hell yeah. I love that. Guys, this is so much fun. I love that. Let's ask our final typical question. Our final question. Typical. Yeah, typical question just what we end the interview with is just what is your relationship with failure?

[46:37] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Oh, I'm trying to get better at it. I'm trying to learn from it. I guess I'm trying to learn from it and not let it dictate too much of the next steps. I think there's a fine line between letting it follow you. So I'm trying to let not carry my failure into my present.

[46:58] Heather Vickery: I love that. It's beautiful. It's great. I love that. Well, where's all the fun places? I know we talked about everything, but just name it all at the end. How can we connect with you? Where can we follow you?

[47:06] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Follow the poems, the writings. The shows. The shows, everything. Duets, volume 11. That's happening at 54 Below in October 24th. Tickets are on sale now. We're at Duets, the concert series on Instagram. You can follow me at Megaminatillo. We haven't put the wiener in there yet.

[47:30] Heather Vickery: You haven't did the what? Excuse me.

[47:34] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You totally went there. I didn't say anything. I'm just clarifying what I heard.

[47:41] Heather Vickery: We didn't even need Alan and his preteen thought process to do it.

[47:46] Megan Minutillo Weiner: You just said we haven't put the wiener in there yet. You did it.

[47:49] Heather Vickery: Oh my god.

[47:53] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I'm not touching that one. I'm not touching that wiener.

[47:56] Heather Vickery: Don't touch it. So I'm at Megaminatillo. Instagram is my social media drug of choice. That's my public facing platform. I can't do the talking, the TikToking. We don't have that. So we have Instagram and Substack. Substack is just at Megaminatillo. It's good attention. Stop making me laugh.

[48:17] Megan Minutillo Weiner: This is the story of my life, Megan. That's why I laugh. Every opening, he does something silly and I laugh. We're going to put all those links in our show notes. This has been so much fun. I hope that we can continue to connect and however we can support you moving forward.

[48:34] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Thank you. Thank you guys.

[48:35] Heather Vickery: Thank you so much.

[48:40] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I love fellow Broadway producers.

[48:42] Heather Vickery: I know. It's so fun. And I love that I get to meet cool people like that on Substack and say, I think you're cool. You want to be a guest on my podcast?

[48:49] Megan Minutillo Weiner: She was a cool guest sandwich because she writes and she does Broadway.

[48:54] Heather Vickery: She does everything.

[48:55] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. So we can both talk to that wiener pretty good.

[49:00] Heather Vickery: Oh, see.

[49:01] Megan Minutillo Weiner: What?

[49:02] Heather Vickery: See, Megan, have you listened this far? I knew he couldn't help it.

[49:05] Megan Minutillo Weiner: What are you talking about? That's her name. I don't know where you're going, where your dirty mind is going. That's her name.

[49:10] Heather Vickery: I knew he couldn't help it.

[49:11] Megan Minutillo Weiner: That's her name.

[49:12] Heather Vickery: But she broke the ice. What can I say? No, it's really fun. What did she say at the end? Oh, we didn't put the wiener in there yet. Yes. Don't put the wiener in there.

[49:21] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I like you. I know I like you for a reason.

[49:28] Heather Vickery: Oh, my goodness gracious. Yeah. I enjoyed her so much. And I love, I mean, we are made of the same stardust, this one and I, Megan and I, like, fuck the traditional job. Fuck the thing that everybody says you have to do to be safe. Go out and find your things you're passionate about and play around with it until you hit on something that works.

[49:52] Megan Minutillo Weiner: And I like, I like, too, that she's OK, not doing everything the goal she set for herself right away. Like that's kind of like, yeah, and that's that's the thing that stresses me out so much as well. And and, you know, like we were talking about getting older, you kind of like let go of the things you can't control. It's one of those things where she's got so much she can do and so much she likes doing that she can shift her focus depending on on, you know, what's calling her at that moment. And I need to take some I need to learn from that a little bit.

[50:22] Heather Vickery: And I think she might be a little surprised. She said it's going to take 20 years to finish the book. It might not. I have a feeling that that space for the book will carve itself out.

[50:34] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. Yeah.

[50:35] Heather Vickery: In the most of unexpected of ways, you know, was a chance.

[50:38] Megan Minutillo Weiner: So I mean, one of those things, too, is like as a as a relatively new parent as well, like as you get older, the kids become more independent. You get a little bit of time back. And I think it's going to take a lot, a lot less than 20 years. That's my prediction.

[50:52] Heather Vickery: So for our 20 years now, for episode one million and three of was a chance, we're going to have her back on. And there you go.

[51:01] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah, I don't have to go see duets.

[51:03] Heather Vickery: I do. I want to. I want to see duets. I know very well. Fifty four below. Lot of good stuff. It's a really great venue. Really pretty. Yeah. You should come into town in October and go see it with me.

[51:12] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I would love to come. We really were manifesting seeing Harry again. So we saw night one and two in Mexico City and it was amazing. Harry Styles. The first night we were in the pit and it started raining. We got very wet, but it was kind of just like a slow rain for hours, which was fine. No show delay. The next night, night two.

[51:40] Heather Vickery: Was this what you sent me the picture of?

[51:41] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Yeah. Oh my gosh.

[51:43] Heather Vickery: Mexico City had a hail storm. They were shoveling hail like it was rock salt to clear the pathways for people.

[51:49] Megan Minutillo Weiner: When you sent me the picture, I thought it was snow.

[51:53] Heather Vickery: I know. It was wild. It was crazy. And then they delayed the show. They canceled the opener. They delayed the show to nine thirty. It's supposed to start at nine. And it was the most perfect night. The sky was clear. The moon was full. The temperature was perfect. This weather was crazy. But the concert was amazing. And I was like, I can't imagine that I won't get to see this show again before the two are in. So I've got to manifest a way to get tickets to see him at Madison Square Garden.

[52:25] Megan Minutillo Weiner: All right. So you come in to MSG and we can go see duets. Hopefully the timeline works out.

[52:32] Heather Vickery: Yep. I got to bring my kid though. She'd kill me if I didn't come with her.

[52:36] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Okay. I haven't met her yet. Let's do it.

[52:38] Heather Vickery: Yeah, we'll do it. Hey, so we tried something new with this episode. And how do you feel about it? We decided we'd do this fast five thing.

[52:44] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I liked it.

[52:47] Heather Vickery: I liked it too. But I think we should swap it. What do you what do you listeners think?

[52:51] Megan Minutillo Weiner: I think we should ask about failure and then close on the fast five.

[52:54] Heather Vickery: Yeah. We'll try that. We'll try that next time.

[52:56] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Try the next time in our recording order, not a release order.

[53:00] Heather Vickery: Correct.

[53:00] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Because we don't release in the order we record. Behind the scenes of podcasting 101.

[53:08] Heather Vickery: We don't.

[53:09] Megan Minutillo Weiner: No. Okay. Well, what do you think, audience? Where can they let us know, Heather?

[53:15] Heather Vickery: You can let us know. You can send us an email. Was it chancepodcast at gmail.com? You can let us know on LinkedIn. Was it Chance Podcast? You can let us know on... Well, you can definitely let us know on Instagram or threads. And hopefully Alan will see it. It won't be me. Or Hany, our podcast assistant. Shout out to Hany. Hey, babe. We love you.

[53:35] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Love you.

[53:37] Heather Vickery: Yeah. I'm on Substack. And Megan's on Substack. And Alan's not on Substack, but he should be. But was it chances on LinkedIn, TikTok, threads, Instagram?

[53:50] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Blue Sky? You're still on Blue Sky?

[53:52] Heather Vickery: Sometimes. Sometimes I'm on Blue Sky.

[53:55] Megan Minutillo Weiner: Anywhere.

[53:56] Heather Vickery: Not very often. Yeah.

[53:57] Megan Minutillo Weiner: But we're out there. Find us.

[54:03] Heather Vickery: Come find us in a DM. Send us an email. We appreciate it. We love hanging out with you. It's so much fun. We love hanging out with each other. We hope you can tell. And you've been listening to Was it Chance? The podcast about embracing opportunity and taking intentional risk for your creative life. I'm Heather Vickery.

[54:14] Alan Seales: And I'm Alan Seales.

[54:16] Heather Vickery: Talk to you all soon.

[54:17] Alan Seales: Bye-bye.

[54:18] Heather Vickery: Bye.